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		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107721</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107721"/>
		<updated>2014-05-31T13:57:34Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:What recognized translations say and what the scholars in the Tafsirs says overrides what you and I say. No I dont have the Arabic tafsirs but what I quoted are the authentic English versions of the Tafsirs. In the Tafsirs when they say &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; they mean &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; and that is true whether it is Arabic or english. One of the Tafsir explains why its wrong to interpret that as &#039;a man and a woman&#039; and it is in fact &#039;two men&#039;. (1) Did you see that explanation? When the Quran says &amp;quot;The two&amp;quot; it is talking about &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; as the Tafsirs from two Islamic scholar explain.&lt;br /&gt;
: (2) Why do you think this verse is saying something new that everything else on that page is not saying? Other Quranic verses and what hadiths say about a topic has to be considered to find out what the meanings are or what Islam says about a topic. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 02:55, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
::Additional translations for &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; [http://quranx.com/4.16]&lt;br /&gt;
:::Ahmad Ali: If two (men) among you are guilty of such acts then punish both of them. But if they repent and reform, let them be, for God accepts repentance and is merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Talal Itani: If two men among you commit it, punish them both. But if they repent and reform, leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Full of Mercy.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Wahihuddin Khan: If two men commit a like abomination, punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, leave them alone. God is forgiving and merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
::--[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 03:11, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I found the Arabic versions of the tafsirs, and what I concluded is that most of the scholars (even the ones you mentioned) don&#039;t know certainly if it was meant for 2 men or a man and woman although some of them believe one of the meanings is more suitable than the other. For example, Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable because the pronoun used is for masculine. But I&#039;ll tell you that in Arabic if you want to refer to a group of people containing both men and women, you use the masculine pronoun, so it isn&#039;t a decisive clue that &amp;quot;2 men&amp;quot; is the meaning here. And I say again that the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; wasn&#039;t mentioned even once in this verse, so if someone, while translating, understands it from the meaning and it&#039;s not written, he should write it within parentheses (if he&#039;s sure) like what Ahmad Ali did. As for Tafsir Ibn-Kathir, he put up 3 possibilities of what the meaning would be, one of which means 2 men. The other tafsirs are mostly the same as these 2.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 03:35, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:This just proves again how false the Quran is when it makes the claim of being in detail and that &amp;quot;Nothing have we omitted from the Book&amp;quot;. A lot has been omitted from the book and a lot is unclear and could have been written in a more clear way. [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Lack_of_Detail_in_the_Quran#Claims_of_Detail]&lt;br /&gt;
:So indeed:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
:It is two men. As for your analysis, again what the two Tafsirs say overrides what you say. &amp;quot;Two men&amp;quot; may not have been mentioned but as the Tafsir says its &#039;&#039;most likely&#039;&#039; two men that the Quran is referring to. &lt;br /&gt;
:What do you think of the reasoning made in the first Tafsir quote?:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;but this [opinion of his] may be countered by the fact that [the reference to] the two [men] becomes clear on account of the particle min being attached to a masculine pronoun [minkum, ‘of you’], and by the fact that they suffer the same punishment, [both effect the action of] repentance and [are both granted] that they be left alone [thereafter], [all of] which applies specifically to men, given that for women detention is stipulated, as was stated before.&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
:Once again I ask you for the 3rd time: Do you think the &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; version of 4:16 goes against what has been said about the topic in other locations? That is all quoted on that [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality page] and this includes [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Qur.27an verses]. The topic of the people of Lut is mentioned in many places on that page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 04:25, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
No I don&#039;t. The point I&#039;m talking about is if &amp;quot;this&amp;quot; and only this verse is talking about 2 men or not, not if the whole thing about homosexuality is true or not. You&#039;re saying the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t as clear and detailed as it claims to be. Hell, if you want it to be clearer and more detailed than that, do you want a 20000-page book that no one can read? God claims the Qur&#039;an is clear and detailed, and indeed it is. He doesn&#039;t say each and every verse has an independent meaning that could be clearly understood while standing alone, but the Qur&#039;an as a whole stands tall, with each verse clarifying the other ones if necessary. Now, if people can understand a verse, then there&#039;s no need to clarify it with other verses, making a 603-page book even bigger. Now, as you can read from Tafsirs, we can infer from other verses and Hadiths the punishments of adultery or homosexuality and apply it here to understand the meaning clearly. So even if you still don&#039;t know the partial meaning of the verse (if it&#039;s 2 or 2 men), you clearly and fully understand the complete meaning of the subject in hand, so what do you want more? Anyway, let&#039;s continue, you again quoted the Grammatical reasoning that was made to prove it, which I already talked about in the last edit. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 05:40, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:We just quote authentic, recognized translations and in addition if they are supported by Tafsirs of of well-renowned Islamic scholars, that is more than what needs to be done. If you have a problem with the sources, you can start contacting Islamic scholars around the world and get them to invalidate Yusuf Ali&#039;s translation and the two Tafsirs (Tafsir Al-Jalalayn and Tafsir Ibn Kathir)&lt;br /&gt;
:I like these kinds of discussions as they result in further improvement of our site. In this case I found out additional Tafsirs should be present on the page. &lt;br /&gt;
:In regards to your comments about Quran getting long if additional detail was added, no it would not. Ideally Quran should not be [https://www.google.com/search?q=quran+repetitive&amp;amp;spell=1&amp;amp;sa=X&amp;amp;ei=f-uIU8CoGoWSqAbizoC4DQ&amp;amp;ved=0CCYQvwUoAA&amp;amp;biw=1920&amp;amp;bih=860 repetitive] and for example contain the same statement [http://quran.com/55/37-78 31 times] (&#039;&#039;&amp;quot;So which of the favors of your Lord would you deny?&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;). 30 of these verses should have been deleted from the Quran and the same words could have been used to fill out many details or perhaps include amazing [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Islam_and_Miracles miraculous] verses which would attempt to prove the &#039;divine&#039; origin of the Quran. In the case of 4:16, it would take only one arabic word to clarify the meaning of this important verse. Mistakes like these further prove the non-divine origin of the Quran and this is realized by those [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/People_Who_Left_Islam who have left Islam] and some of them have submitted testimonies on our site using an [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Special:Form/newapostate online form]. You&#039;re welcome to use that form in the future if you change your mind about Islam. But such debates are for the [http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/ FFI forum] which you can visit. &lt;br /&gt;
:Let me know if you have any other issues relating to this article or comments that could result in the improvement of the page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 13:41, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I know that u quote authentic, recognized translations and well-renowed Islamic scholars, but you&#039;re ignoring the fact that Muslims believe only the Qur&#039;an doesn&#039;t contain mistakes (in addition to Hadiths that were truly told by Prophet Muhammad PBUH), so even scholars and translators commit mistakes (example: Ibn-Abbas (Or Ibn-Kathir, I don&#039;t remember) said while explaining a verse that the Earth is flat. Does that mean Islam believes Earth is flat? No, it&#039;s just that he committed a mistake based on what they thought back then)  &lt;br /&gt;
I, too, like these discussions because whenever I take part in one, I find out that Islam is always prejudged. &lt;br /&gt;
As for why the same verse was repeated 31 times, I don&#039;t know why, and no one can know why because God is all-knowing (but I&#039;m sure it has to contain some &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; meaning as you were saying, so discussions about Islam based on the &amp;quot;reason&amp;quot; of saying something in the Qur&#039;an are invalid because God knows the reasons of what we do, but the opposite isn&#039;t correct. So, the &amp;quot;divine&amp;quot; origin of the Qur&#039;an as you like to quote it is proved not by the reason (although it is proved based on the reaspons in some places that we know about), but rather by the divine &amp;quot;meaning&amp;quot;, &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; verses and other fields...&lt;br /&gt;
Don&#039;t worry, I&#039;ll not change my mind anytime soon because I&#039;m sure of my religion. And again I&#039;ll repeat, repeating something for its importance is not considered a mistake, and not mentioning something is also not considered a mistake.&lt;br /&gt;
As for faithfreedom, I registered there when you suggested that I do, but I&#039;ve still not gotten an answer yet... Seems they didn&#039;t accept my membership for some reason (or I made a mistake of some kind, but I don&#039;t think so)--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 04:39, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:You and me are some anonymous username on the internet and we do not have the religious authority to say multiple recognized famous Islamic scholars, Tafsir authors and translators made a mistake. Also other anti-homosexuality verses have to be considered to know what the meaning was and you have been completely ignoring those verses (people of Lut) and other hadiths. It is clear the Quran is anti-homosexuality. You cannot look at one Quran verse and decide it must mean something that you want it to mean and ignore everything else and what scholars have said. Everything has to be considered while interpreting the Quran but ok, how someone interprets the Quran is up to them.&lt;br /&gt;
:You can email the FFI people here and ask them about forum issues [http://www.faithfreedom.org/contact-us/] but yes they&#039;ll be happy to debate with you. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 05:54, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Note that I did not say the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t against homosexuality. I&#039;m just saying that I think this particular verse doesn&#039;t have to do with it. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Also, you should know that when I said Muslims believe scholars and translators would be wrong and that only the Qur&#039;an and Hadiths (the ones we&#039;re sure of) don&#039;t have mistakes, I didn&#039;t decide that on my own. It&#039;s an Islamic rule.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
As for the FFI forum, I&#039;ll try talking to them. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 06:51, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107720</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107720"/>
		<updated>2014-05-31T13:55:07Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:What recognized translations say and what the scholars in the Tafsirs says overrides what you and I say. No I dont have the Arabic tafsirs but what I quoted are the authentic English versions of the Tafsirs. In the Tafsirs when they say &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; they mean &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; and that is true whether it is Arabic or english. One of the Tafsir explains why its wrong to interpret that as &#039;a man and a woman&#039; and it is in fact &#039;two men&#039;. (1) Did you see that explanation? When the Quran says &amp;quot;The two&amp;quot; it is talking about &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; as the Tafsirs from two Islamic scholar explain.&lt;br /&gt;
: (2) Why do you think this verse is saying something new that everything else on that page is not saying? Other Quranic verses and what hadiths say about a topic has to be considered to find out what the meanings are or what Islam says about a topic. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 02:55, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
::Additional translations for &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; [http://quranx.com/4.16]&lt;br /&gt;
:::Ahmad Ali: If two (men) among you are guilty of such acts then punish both of them. But if they repent and reform, let them be, for God accepts repentance and is merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Talal Itani: If two men among you commit it, punish them both. But if they repent and reform, leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Full of Mercy.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Wahihuddin Khan: If two men commit a like abomination, punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, leave them alone. God is forgiving and merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
::--[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 03:11, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I found the Arabic versions of the tafsirs, and what I concluded is that most of the scholars (even the ones you mentioned) don&#039;t know certainly if it was meant for 2 men or a man and woman although some of them believe one of the meanings is more suitable than the other. For example, Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable because the pronoun used is for masculine. But I&#039;ll tell you that in Arabic if you want to refer to a group of people containing both men and women, you use the masculine pronoun, so it isn&#039;t a decisive clue that &amp;quot;2 men&amp;quot; is the meaning here. And I say again that the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; wasn&#039;t mentioned even once in this verse, so if someone, while translating, understands it from the meaning and it&#039;s not written, he should write it within parentheses (if he&#039;s sure) like what Ahmad Ali did. As for Tafsir Ibn-Kathir, he put up 3 possibilities of what the meaning would be, one of which means 2 men. The other tafsirs are mostly the same as these 2.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 03:35, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:This just proves again how false the Quran is when it makes the claim of being in detail and that &amp;quot;Nothing have we omitted from the Book&amp;quot;. A lot has been omitted from the book and a lot is unclear and could have been written in a more clear way. [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Lack_of_Detail_in_the_Quran#Claims_of_Detail]&lt;br /&gt;
:So indeed:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
:It is two men. As for your analysis, again what the two Tafsirs say overrides what you say. &amp;quot;Two men&amp;quot; may not have been mentioned but as the Tafsir says its &#039;&#039;most likely&#039;&#039; two men that the Quran is referring to. &lt;br /&gt;
:What do you think of the reasoning made in the first Tafsir quote?:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;but this [opinion of his] may be countered by the fact that [the reference to] the two [men] becomes clear on account of the particle min being attached to a masculine pronoun [minkum, ‘of you’], and by the fact that they suffer the same punishment, [both effect the action of] repentance and [are both granted] that they be left alone [thereafter], [all of] which applies specifically to men, given that for women detention is stipulated, as was stated before.&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
:Once again I ask you for the 3rd time: Do you think the &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; version of 4:16 goes against what has been said about the topic in other locations? That is all quoted on that [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality page] and this includes [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Qur.27an verses]. The topic of the people of Lut is mentioned in many places on that page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 04:25, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
No I don&#039;t. The point I&#039;m talking about is if &amp;quot;this&amp;quot; and only this verse is talking about 2 men or not, not if the whole thing about homosexuality is true or not. You&#039;re saying the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t as clear and detailed as it claims to be. Hell, if you want it to be clearer and more detailed than that, do you want a 20000-page book that no one can read? God claims the Qur&#039;an is clear and detailed, and indeed it is. He doesn&#039;t say each and every verse has an independent meaning that could be clearly understood while standing alone, but the Qur&#039;an as a whole stands tall, with each verse clarifying the other ones if necessary. Now, if people can understand a verse, then there&#039;s no need to clarify it with other verses, making a 603-page book even bigger. Now, as you can read from Tafsirs, we can infer from other verses and Hadiths the punishments of adultery or homosexuality and apply it here to understand the meaning clearly. So even if you still don&#039;t know the partial meaning of the verse (if it&#039;s 2 or 2 men), you clearly and fully understand the complete meaning of the subject in hand, so what do you want more? Anyway, let&#039;s continue, you again quoted the Grammatical reasoning that was made to prove it, which I already talked about in the last edit. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 05:40, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:We just quote authentic, recognized translations and in addition if they are supported by Tafsirs of of well-renowned Islamic scholars, that is more than what needs to be done. If you have a problem with the sources, you can start contacting Islamic scholars around the world and get them to invalidate Yusuf Ali&#039;s translation and the two Tafsirs (Tafsir Al-Jalalayn and Tafsir Ibn Kathir)&lt;br /&gt;
:I like these kinds of discussions as they result in further improvement of our site. In this case I found out additional Tafsirs should be present on the page. &lt;br /&gt;
:In regards to your comments about Quran getting long if additional detail was added, no it would not. Ideally Quran should not be [https://www.google.com/search?q=quran+repetitive&amp;amp;spell=1&amp;amp;sa=X&amp;amp;ei=f-uIU8CoGoWSqAbizoC4DQ&amp;amp;ved=0CCYQvwUoAA&amp;amp;biw=1920&amp;amp;bih=860 repetitive] and for example contain the same statement [http://quran.com/55/37-78 31 times] (&#039;&#039;&amp;quot;So which of the favors of your Lord would you deny?&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;). 30 of these verses should have been deleted from the Quran and the same words could have been used to fill out many details or perhaps include amazing [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Islam_and_Miracles miraculous] verses which would attempt to prove the &#039;divine&#039; origin of the Quran. In the case of 4:16, it would take only one arabic word to clarify the meaning of this important verse. Mistakes like these further prove the non-divine origin of the Quran and this is realized by those [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/People_Who_Left_Islam who have left Islam] and some of them have submitted testimonies on our site using an [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Special:Form/newapostate online form]. You&#039;re welcome to use that form in the future if you change your mind about Islam. But such debates are for the [http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/ FFI forum] which you can visit. &lt;br /&gt;
:Let me know if you have any other issues relating to this article or comments that could result in the improvement of the page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 13:41, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I know that u quote authentic, recognized translations and well-renowed Islamic scholars, but you&#039;re ignoring the fact that Muslims believe only the Qur&#039;an doesn&#039;t contain mistakes (in addition to Hadiths that were truly told by Prophet Muhammad PBUH), so even scholars and translators commit mistakes (example: Ibn-Abbas (Or Ibn-Kathir, I don&#039;t remember) said while explaining a verse that the Earth is flat. Does that mean Islam believes Earth is flat? No, it&#039;s just that he committed a mistake based on what they thought back then)  &lt;br /&gt;
I, too, like these discussions because whenever I take part in one, I find out that Islam is always prejudged. &lt;br /&gt;
As for why the same verse was repeated 31 times, I don&#039;t know why, and no one can know why because God is all-knowing (but I&#039;m sure it has to contain some &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; meaning as you were saying, so discussions about Islam based on the &amp;quot;reason&amp;quot; of saying something in the Qur&#039;an are invalid because God knows the reasons of what we do, but the opposite isn&#039;t correct. So, the &amp;quot;divine&amp;quot; origin of the Qur&#039;an as you like to quote it is proved not by the reason (although it is proved based on the reaspons in some places that we know about), but rather by the divine &amp;quot;meaning&amp;quot;, &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; verses and other fields...&lt;br /&gt;
Don&#039;t worry, I&#039;ll not change my mind anytime soon because I&#039;m sure of my religion. And again I&#039;ll repeat, repeating something for its importance is not considered a mistake, and not mentioning something is also not considered a mistake.&lt;br /&gt;
As for faithfreedom, I registered there when you suggested that I do, but I&#039;ve still not gotten an answer yet... Seems they didn&#039;t accept my membership for some reason (or I made a mistake of some kind, but I don&#039;t think so)--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 04:39, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:You and me are some anonymous username on the internet and we do not have the religious authority to say multiple recognized famous Islamic scholars, Tafsir authors and translators made a mistake. Also other anti-homosexuality verses have to be considered to know what the meaning was and you have been completely ignoring those verses (people of Lut) and other hadiths. It is clear the Quran is anti-homosexuality. You cannot look at one Quran verse and decide it must mean something that you want it to mean and ignore everything else and what scholars have said. Everything has to be considered while interpreting the Quran but ok, how someone interprets the Quran is up to them.&lt;br /&gt;
:You can email the FFI people here and ask them about forum issues [http://www.faithfreedom.org/contact-us/] but yes they&#039;ll be happy to debate with you. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 05:54, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Note that I&#039;m not saying the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t against homosexuality. I&#039;m just saying that I think this verse doesn&#039;t have to so with it. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Also, you should know that when I said Muslims believe scholars and translators would be wrong and that only the Qur&#039;an and Hadiths (the ones we&#039;re sure of) don&#039;t have mistakes, I didn&#039;t decide that on my own. It&#039;s an Islamic rule.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
As for the FFI forum, I&#039;ll try talking to them. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 06:51, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107719</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107719"/>
		<updated>2014-05-31T13:51:54Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:What recognized translations say and what the scholars in the Tafsirs says overrides what you and I say. No I dont have the Arabic tafsirs but what I quoted are the authentic English versions of the Tafsirs. In the Tafsirs when they say &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; they mean &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; and that is true whether it is Arabic or english. One of the Tafsir explains why its wrong to interpret that as &#039;a man and a woman&#039; and it is in fact &#039;two men&#039;. (1) Did you see that explanation? When the Quran says &amp;quot;The two&amp;quot; it is talking about &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; as the Tafsirs from two Islamic scholar explain.&lt;br /&gt;
: (2) Why do you think this verse is saying something new that everything else on that page is not saying? Other Quranic verses and what hadiths say about a topic has to be considered to find out what the meanings are or what Islam says about a topic. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 02:55, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
::Additional translations for &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; [http://quranx.com/4.16]&lt;br /&gt;
:::Ahmad Ali: If two (men) among you are guilty of such acts then punish both of them. But if they repent and reform, let them be, for God accepts repentance and is merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Talal Itani: If two men among you commit it, punish them both. But if they repent and reform, leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Full of Mercy.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Wahihuddin Khan: If two men commit a like abomination, punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, leave them alone. God is forgiving and merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
::--[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 03:11, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I found the Arabic versions of the tafsirs, and what I concluded is that most of the scholars (even the ones you mentioned) don&#039;t know certainly if it was meant for 2 men or a man and woman although some of them believe one of the meanings is more suitable than the other. For example, Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable because the pronoun used is for masculine. But I&#039;ll tell you that in Arabic if you want to refer to a group of people containing both men and women, you use the masculine pronoun, so it isn&#039;t a decisive clue that &amp;quot;2 men&amp;quot; is the meaning here. And I say again that the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; wasn&#039;t mentioned even once in this verse, so if someone, while translating, understands it from the meaning and it&#039;s not written, he should write it within parentheses (if he&#039;s sure) like what Ahmad Ali did. As for Tafsir Ibn-Kathir, he put up 3 possibilities of what the meaning would be, one of which means 2 men. The other tafsirs are mostly the same as these 2.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 03:35, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:This just proves again how false the Quran is when it makes the claim of being in detail and that &amp;quot;Nothing have we omitted from the Book&amp;quot;. A lot has been omitted from the book and a lot is unclear and could have been written in a more clear way. [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Lack_of_Detail_in_the_Quran#Claims_of_Detail]&lt;br /&gt;
:So indeed:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
:It is two men. As for your analysis, again what the two Tafsirs say overrides what you say. &amp;quot;Two men&amp;quot; may not have been mentioned but as the Tafsir says its &#039;&#039;most likely&#039;&#039; two men that the Quran is referring to. &lt;br /&gt;
:What do you think of the reasoning made in the first Tafsir quote?:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;but this [opinion of his] may be countered by the fact that [the reference to] the two [men] becomes clear on account of the particle min being attached to a masculine pronoun [minkum, ‘of you’], and by the fact that they suffer the same punishment, [both effect the action of] repentance and [are both granted] that they be left alone [thereafter], [all of] which applies specifically to men, given that for women detention is stipulated, as was stated before.&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
:Once again I ask you for the 3rd time: Do you think the &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; version of 4:16 goes against what has been said about the topic in other locations? That is all quoted on that [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality page] and this includes [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Qur.27an verses]. The topic of the people of Lut is mentioned in many places on that page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 04:25, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
No I don&#039;t. The point I&#039;m talking about is if &amp;quot;this&amp;quot; and only this verse is talking about 2 men or not, not if the whole thing about homosexuality is true or not. You&#039;re saying the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t as clear and detailed as it claims to be. Hell, if you want it to be clearer and more detailed than that, do you want a 20000-page book that no one can read? God claims the Qur&#039;an is clear and detailed, and indeed it is. He doesn&#039;t say each and every verse has an independent meaning that could be clearly understood while standing alone, but the Qur&#039;an as a whole stands tall, with each verse clarifying the other ones if necessary. Now, if people can understand a verse, then there&#039;s no need to clarify it with other verses, making a 603-page book even bigger. Now, as you can read from Tafsirs, we can infer from other verses and Hadiths the punishments of adultery or homosexuality and apply it here to understand the meaning clearly. So even if you still don&#039;t know the partial meaning of the verse (if it&#039;s 2 or 2 men), you clearly and fully understand the complete meaning of the subject in hand, so what do you want more? Anyway, let&#039;s continue, you again quoted the Grammatical reasoning that was made to prove it, which I already talked about in the last edit. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 05:40, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:We just quote authentic, recognized translations and in addition if they are supported by Tafsirs of of well-renowned Islamic scholars, that is more than what needs to be done. If you have a problem with the sources, you can start contacting Islamic scholars around the world and get them to invalidate Yusuf Ali&#039;s translation and the two Tafsirs (Tafsir Al-Jalalayn and Tafsir Ibn Kathir)&lt;br /&gt;
:I like these kinds of discussions as they result in further improvement of our site. In this case I found out additional Tafsirs should be present on the page. &lt;br /&gt;
:In regards to your comments about Quran getting long if additional detail was added, no it would not. Ideally Quran should not be [https://www.google.com/search?q=quran+repetitive&amp;amp;spell=1&amp;amp;sa=X&amp;amp;ei=f-uIU8CoGoWSqAbizoC4DQ&amp;amp;ved=0CCYQvwUoAA&amp;amp;biw=1920&amp;amp;bih=860 repetitive] and for example contain the same statement [http://quran.com/55/37-78 31 times] (&#039;&#039;&amp;quot;So which of the favors of your Lord would you deny?&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;). 30 of these verses should have been deleted from the Quran and the same words could have been used to fill out many details or perhaps include amazing [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Islam_and_Miracles miraculous] verses which would attempt to prove the &#039;divine&#039; origin of the Quran. In the case of 4:16, it would take only one arabic word to clarify the meaning of this important verse. Mistakes like these further prove the non-divine origin of the Quran and this is realized by those [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/People_Who_Left_Islam who have left Islam] and some of them have submitted testimonies on our site using an [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Special:Form/newapostate online form]. You&#039;re welcome to use that form in the future if you change your mind about Islam. But such debates are for the [http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/ FFI forum] which you can visit. &lt;br /&gt;
:Let me know if you have any other issues relating to this article or comments that could result in the improvement of the page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 13:41, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I know that u quote authentic, recognized translations and well-renowed Islamic scholars, but you&#039;re ignoring the fact that Muslims believe only the Qur&#039;an doesn&#039;t contain mistakes (in addition to Hadiths that were truly told by Prophet Muhammad PBUH), so even scholars and translators commit mistakes (example: Ibn-Abbas (Or Ibn-Kathir, I don&#039;t remember) said while explaining a verse that the Earth is flat. Does that mean Islam believes Earth is flat? No, it&#039;s just that he committed a mistake based on what they thought back then)  &lt;br /&gt;
I, too, like these discussions because whenever I take part in one, I find out that Islam is always prejudged. &lt;br /&gt;
As for why the same verse was repeated 31 times, I don&#039;t know why, and no one can know why because God is all-knowing (but I&#039;m sure it has to contain some &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; meaning as you were saying, so discussions about Islam based on the &amp;quot;reason&amp;quot; of saying something in the Qur&#039;an are invalid because God knows the reasons of what we do, but the opposite isn&#039;t correct. So, the &amp;quot;divine&amp;quot; origin of the Qur&#039;an as you like to quote it is proved not by the reason (although it is proved based on the reaspons in some places that we know about), but rather by the divine &amp;quot;meaning&amp;quot;, &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; verses and other fields...&lt;br /&gt;
Don&#039;t worry, I&#039;ll not change my mind anytime soon because I&#039;m sure of my religion. And again I&#039;ll repeat, repeating something for its importance is not considered a mistake, and not mentioning something is also not considered a mistake.&lt;br /&gt;
As for faithfreedom, I registered there when you suggested that I do, but I&#039;ve still not gotten an answer yet... Seems they didn&#039;t accept my membership for some reason (or I made a mistake of some kind, but I don&#039;t think so)--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 04:39, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:You and me are some anonymous username on the internet and we do not have the religious authority to say multiple recognized famous Islamic scholars, Tafsir authors and translators made a mistake. Also other anti-homosexuality verses have to be considered to know what the meaning was and you have been completely ignoring those verses (people of Lut) and other hadiths. It is clear the Quran is anti-homosexuality. You cannot look at one Quran verse and decide it must mean something that you want it to mean and ignore everything else and what scholars have said. Everything has to be considered while interpreting the Quran but ok, how someone interprets the Quran is up to them.&lt;br /&gt;
:You can email the FFI people here and ask them about forum issues [http://www.faithfreedom.org/contact-us/] but yes they&#039;ll be happy to debate with you. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 05:54, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Note that I&#039;m not saying the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t against homosexuality. I&#039;m just saying that I think this verse doesn&#039;t have to so with it. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
As for the FFI forum, I&#039;ll try talking to them. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 06:51, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107713</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107713"/>
		<updated>2014-05-31T11:39:15Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:What recognized translations say and what the scholars in the Tafsirs says overrides what you and I say. No I dont have the Arabic tafsirs but what I quoted are the authentic English versions of the Tafsirs. In the Tafsirs when they say &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; they mean &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; and that is true whether it is Arabic or english. One of the Tafsir explains why its wrong to interpret that as &#039;a man and a woman&#039; and it is in fact &#039;two men&#039;. (1) Did you see that explanation? When the Quran says &amp;quot;The two&amp;quot; it is talking about &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; as the Tafsirs from two Islamic scholar explain.&lt;br /&gt;
: (2) Why do you think this verse is saying something new that everything else on that page is not saying? Other Quranic verses and what hadiths say about a topic has to be considered to find out what the meanings are or what Islam says about a topic. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 02:55, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
::Additional translations for &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; [http://quranx.com/4.16]&lt;br /&gt;
:::Ahmad Ali: If two (men) among you are guilty of such acts then punish both of them. But if they repent and reform, let them be, for God accepts repentance and is merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Talal Itani: If two men among you commit it, punish them both. But if they repent and reform, leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Full of Mercy.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Wahihuddin Khan: If two men commit a like abomination, punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, leave them alone. God is forgiving and merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
::--[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 03:11, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I found the Arabic versions of the tafsirs, and what I concluded is that most of the scholars (even the ones you mentioned) don&#039;t know certainly if it was meant for 2 men or a man and woman although some of them believe one of the meanings is more suitable than the other. For example, Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable because the pronoun used is for masculine. But I&#039;ll tell you that in Arabic if you want to refer to a group of people containing both men and women, you use the masculine pronoun, so it isn&#039;t a decisive clue that &amp;quot;2 men&amp;quot; is the meaning here. And I say again that the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; wasn&#039;t mentioned even once in this verse, so if someone, while translating, understands it from the meaning and it&#039;s not written, he should write it within parentheses (if he&#039;s sure) like what Ahmad Ali did. As for Tafsir Ibn-Kathir, he put up 3 possibilities of what the meaning would be, one of which means 2 men. The other tafsirs are mostly the same as these 2.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 03:35, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:This just proves again how false the Quran is when it makes the claim of being in detail and that &amp;quot;Nothing have we omitted from the Book&amp;quot;. A lot has been omitted from the book and a lot is unclear and could have been written in a more clear way. [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Lack_of_Detail_in_the_Quran#Claims_of_Detail]&lt;br /&gt;
:So indeed:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
:It is two men. As for your analysis, again what the two Tafsirs say overrides what you say. &amp;quot;Two men&amp;quot; may not have been mentioned but as the Tafsir says its &#039;&#039;most likely&#039;&#039; two men that the Quran is referring to. &lt;br /&gt;
:What do you think of the reasoning made in the first Tafsir quote?:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;but this [opinion of his] may be countered by the fact that [the reference to] the two [men] becomes clear on account of the particle min being attached to a masculine pronoun [minkum, ‘of you’], and by the fact that they suffer the same punishment, [both effect the action of] repentance and [are both granted] that they be left alone [thereafter], [all of] which applies specifically to men, given that for women detention is stipulated, as was stated before.&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
:Once again I ask you for the 3rd time: Do you think the &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; version of 4:16 goes against what has been said about the topic in other locations? That is all quoted on that [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality page] and this includes [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Qur.27an verses]. The topic of the people of Lut is mentioned in many places on that page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 04:25, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
No I don&#039;t. The point I&#039;m talking about is if &amp;quot;this&amp;quot; and only this verse is talking about 2 men or not, not if the whole thing about homosexuality is true or not. You&#039;re saying the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t as clear and detailed as it claims to be. Hell, if you want it to be clearer and more detailed than that, do you want a 20000-page book that no one can read? God claims the Qur&#039;an is clear and detailed, and indeed it is. He doesn&#039;t say each and every verse has an independent meaning that could be clearly understood while standing alone, but the Qur&#039;an as a whole stands tall, with each verse clarifying the other ones if necessary. Now, if people can understand a verse, then there&#039;s no need to clarify it with other verses, making a 603-page book even bigger. Now, as you can read from Tafsirs, we can infer from other verses and Hadiths the punishments of adultery or homosexuality and apply it here to understand the meaning clearly. So even if you still don&#039;t know the partial meaning of the verse (if it&#039;s 2 or 2 men), you clearly and fully understand the complete meaning of the subject in hand, so what do you want more? Anyway, let&#039;s continue, you again quoted the Grammatical reasoning that was made to prove it, which I already talked about in the last edit. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 05:40, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:We just quote authentic, recognized translations and in addition if they are supported by Tafsirs of of well-renowned Islamic scholars, that is more than what needs to be done. If you have a problem with the sources, you can start contacting Islamic scholars around the world and get them to invalidate Yusuf Ali&#039;s translation and the two Tafsirs (Tafsir Al-Jalalayn and Tafsir Ibn Kathir)&lt;br /&gt;
:I like these kinds of discussions as they result in further improvement of our site. In this case I found out additional Tafsirs should be present on the page. &lt;br /&gt;
:In regards to your comments about Quran getting long if additional detail was added, no it would not. Ideally Quran should not be [https://www.google.com/search?q=quran+repetitive&amp;amp;spell=1&amp;amp;sa=X&amp;amp;ei=f-uIU8CoGoWSqAbizoC4DQ&amp;amp;ved=0CCYQvwUoAA&amp;amp;biw=1920&amp;amp;bih=860 repetitive] and for example contain the same statement [http://quran.com/55/37-78 31 times] (&#039;&#039;&amp;quot;So which of the favors of your Lord would you deny?&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;). 30 of these verses should have been deleted from the Quran and the same words could have been used to fill out many details or perhaps include amazing [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Islam_and_Miracles miraculous] verses which would attempt to prove the &#039;divine&#039; origin of the Quran. In the case of 4:16, it would take only one arabic word to clarify the meaning of this important verse. Mistakes like these further prove the non-divine origin of the Quran and this is realized by those [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/People_Who_Left_Islam who have left Islam] and some of them have submitted testimonies on our site using an [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Special:Form/newapostate online form]. You&#039;re welcome to use that form in the future if you change your mind about Islam. But such debates are for the [http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/ FFI forum] which you can visit. &lt;br /&gt;
:Let me know if you have any other issues relating to this article or comments that could result in the improvement of the page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 13:41, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I know that u quote authentic, recognized translations and well-renowed Islamic scholars, but you&#039;re ignoring the fact that Muslims believe only the Qur&#039;an doesn&#039;t contain mistakes (in addition to Hadiths that were truly told by Prophet Muhammad PBUH), so even scholars and translators commit mistakes (example: Ibn-Abbas (Or Ibn-Kathir, I don&#039;t remember) said while explaining a verse that the Earth is flat. Does that mean Islam believes Earth is flat? No, it&#039;s just that he committed a mistake based on what they thought back then)  &lt;br /&gt;
I, too, like these discussions because whenever I take part in one, I find out that Islam is always prejudged. &lt;br /&gt;
As for why the same verse was repeated 31 times, I don&#039;t know why, and no one can know why because God is all-knowing (but I&#039;m sure it has to contain some &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; meaning as you were saying, so discussions about Islam based on the &amp;quot;reason&amp;quot; of saying something in the Qur&#039;an are invalid because God knows the reasons of what we do, but the opposite isn&#039;t correct. So, the &amp;quot;divine&amp;quot; origin of the Qur&#039;an as you like to quote it is proved not by the reason (although it is proved based on the reaspons in some places that we know about), but rather by the divine &amp;quot;meaning&amp;quot;, &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; verses and other fields...&lt;br /&gt;
Don&#039;t worry, I&#039;ll not change my mind anytime soon because I&#039;m sure of my religion. And again I&#039;ll repeat, repeating something for its importance is not considered a mistake, and not mentioning something is also not considered a mistake.&lt;br /&gt;
As for faithfreedom, I registered there when you suggested that I do, but I&#039;ve still not gotten an answer yet... Seems they didn&#039;t accept my membership for some reason (or I made a mistake of some kind, but I don&#039;t think so)--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 04:39, 31 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107712</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107712"/>
		<updated>2014-05-31T11:38:51Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:What recognized translations say and what the scholars in the Tafsirs says overrides what you and I say. No I dont have the Arabic tafsirs but what I quoted are the authentic English versions of the Tafsirs. In the Tafsirs when they say &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; they mean &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; and that is true whether it is Arabic or english. One of the Tafsir explains why its wrong to interpret that as &#039;a man and a woman&#039; and it is in fact &#039;two men&#039;. (1) Did you see that explanation? When the Quran says &amp;quot;The two&amp;quot; it is talking about &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; as the Tafsirs from two Islamic scholar explain.&lt;br /&gt;
: (2) Why do you think this verse is saying something new that everything else on that page is not saying? Other Quranic verses and what hadiths say about a topic has to be considered to find out what the meanings are or what Islam says about a topic. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 02:55, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
::Additional translations for &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; [http://quranx.com/4.16]&lt;br /&gt;
:::Ahmad Ali: If two (men) among you are guilty of such acts then punish both of them. But if they repent and reform, let them be, for God accepts repentance and is merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Talal Itani: If two men among you commit it, punish them both. But if they repent and reform, leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Full of Mercy.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Wahihuddin Khan: If two men commit a like abomination, punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, leave them alone. God is forgiving and merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
::--[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 03:11, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I found the Arabic versions of the tafsirs, and what I concluded is that most of the scholars (even the ones you mentioned) don&#039;t know certainly if it was meant for 2 men or a man and woman although some of them believe one of the meanings is more suitable than the other. For example, Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable because the pronoun used is for masculine. But I&#039;ll tell you that in Arabic if you want to refer to a group of people containing both men and women, you use the masculine pronoun, so it isn&#039;t a decisive clue that &amp;quot;2 men&amp;quot; is the meaning here. And I say again that the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; wasn&#039;t mentioned even once in this verse, so if someone, while translating, understands it from the meaning and it&#039;s not written, he should write it within parentheses (if he&#039;s sure) like what Ahmad Ali did. As for Tafsir Ibn-Kathir, he put up 3 possibilities of what the meaning would be, one of which means 2 men. The other tafsirs are mostly the same as these 2.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 03:35, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:This just proves again how false the Quran is when it makes the claim of being in detail and that &amp;quot;Nothing have we omitted from the Book&amp;quot;. A lot has been omitted from the book and a lot is unclear and could have been written in a more clear way. [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Lack_of_Detail_in_the_Quran#Claims_of_Detail]&lt;br /&gt;
:So indeed:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
:It is two men. As for your analysis, again what the two Tafsirs say overrides what you say. &amp;quot;Two men&amp;quot; may not have been mentioned but as the Tafsir says its &#039;&#039;most likely&#039;&#039; two men that the Quran is referring to. &lt;br /&gt;
:What do you think of the reasoning made in the first Tafsir quote?:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;but this [opinion of his] may be countered by the fact that [the reference to] the two [men] becomes clear on account of the particle min being attached to a masculine pronoun [minkum, ‘of you’], and by the fact that they suffer the same punishment, [both effect the action of] repentance and [are both granted] that they be left alone [thereafter], [all of] which applies specifically to men, given that for women detention is stipulated, as was stated before.&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
:Once again I ask you for the 3rd time: Do you think the &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; version of 4:16 goes against what has been said about the topic in other locations? That is all quoted on that [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality page] and this includes [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Qur.27an verses]. The topic of the people of Lut is mentioned in many places on that page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 04:25, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
No I don&#039;t. The point I&#039;m talking about is if &amp;quot;this&amp;quot; and only this verse is talking about 2 men or not, not if the whole thing about homosexuality is true or not. You&#039;re saying the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t as clear and detailed as it claims to be. Hell, if you want it to be clearer and more detailed than that, do you want a 20000-page book that no one can read? God claims the Qur&#039;an is clear and detailed, and indeed it is. He doesn&#039;t say each and every verse has an independent meaning that could be clearly understood while standing alone, but the Qur&#039;an as a whole stands tall, with each verse clarifying the other ones if necessary. Now, if people can understand a verse, then there&#039;s no need to clarify it with other verses, making a 603-page book even bigger. Now, as you can read from Tafsirs, we can infer from other verses and Hadiths the punishments of adultery or homosexuality and apply it here to understand the meaning clearly. So even if you still don&#039;t know the partial meaning of the verse (if it&#039;s 2 or 2 men), you clearly and fully understand the complete meaning of the subject in hand, so what do you want more? Anyway, let&#039;s continue, you again quoted the Grammatical reasoning that was made to prove it, which I already talked about in the last edit. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 05:40, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:We just quote authentic, recognized translations and in addition if they are supported by Tafsirs of of well-renowned Islamic scholars, that is more than what needs to be done. If you have a problem with the sources, you can start contacting Islamic scholars around the world and get them to invalidate Yusuf Ali&#039;s translation and the two Tafsirs (Tafsir Al-Jalalayn and Tafsir Ibn Kathir)&lt;br /&gt;
:I like these kinds of discussions as they result in further improvement of our site. In this case I found out additional Tafsirs should be present on the page. &lt;br /&gt;
:In regards to your comments about Quran getting long if additional detail was added, no it would not. Ideally Quran should not be [https://www.google.com/search?q=quran+repetitive&amp;amp;spell=1&amp;amp;sa=X&amp;amp;ei=f-uIU8CoGoWSqAbizoC4DQ&amp;amp;ved=0CCYQvwUoAA&amp;amp;biw=1920&amp;amp;bih=860 repetitive] and for example contain the same statement [http://quran.com/55/37-78 31 times] (&#039;&#039;&amp;quot;So which of the favors of your Lord would you deny?&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;). 30 of these verses should have been deleted from the Quran and the same words could have been used to fill out many details or perhaps include amazing [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Islam_and_Miracles miraculous] verses which would attempt to prove the &#039;divine&#039; origin of the Quran. In the case of 4:16, it would take only one arabic word to clarify the meaning of this important verse. Mistakes like these further prove the non-divine origin of the Quran and this is realized by those [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/People_Who_Left_Islam who have left Islam] and some of them have submitted testimonies on our site using an [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Special:Form/newapostate online form]. You&#039;re welcome to use that form in the future if you change your mind about Islam. But such debates are for the [http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/ FFI forum] which you can visit. &lt;br /&gt;
:Let me know if you have any other issues relating to this article or comments that could result in the improvement of the page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 13:41, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I know that u quote authentic, recognized translations and well-renowed Islamic scholars, but you&#039;re ignoring the fact that Muslims believe only the Qur&#039;an doesn&#039;t contain mistakes (in addition to Hadiths that were truly told by Prophet Muhammad PBUH), so even scholars and translators commit mistakes (example: Ibn-Abbas (Or Ibn-Kathir, I don&#039;t remember) said while explaining a verse that the Earth is flat. Does that mean Islam believes Earth is flat? No, it&#039;s just that he committed a mistake based on what they thought back then)  &lt;br /&gt;
I, too, like these discussions because whenever I take part in one, I find out that Islam is always prejudged. &lt;br /&gt;
As for why the same verse was repeated 31 times, I don&#039;t know why, and no one can know why because God is all-knowing (but I&#039;m sure it has to contain some &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; meaning as you were saying, so discussions about Islam based on the &amp;quot;reason&amp;quot; of saying something in the Qur&#039;an are invalid because God knows the reasons of what we do, but the opposite isn&#039;t correct. So, the &amp;quot;divine&amp;quot; origin of the Qur&#039;an as you like to quote it is proved not by the reason (although it is proved based on the reaspons in some places that we know about), but rather by the divine &amp;quot;meaning&amp;quot;, &amp;quot;miraculous&amp;quot; verses and other fields...&lt;br /&gt;
Don&#039;t worry, I&#039;ll not change my mind anytime soon because I&#039;m sure of my religion. And again I&#039;ll repeat, repeating something for its importance is not considered a mistake, and not mentioning something is also not considered a mistake.&lt;br /&gt;
As for faithfreedom, I registered there when you suggested that I do, but I&#039;ve still not gotten an answer yet... Seems they didn&#039;t accept my membership for some reason (or I made a mistake of some kind, but I don&#039;t think so)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107704</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107704"/>
		<updated>2014-05-30T12:41:00Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:What recognized translations say and what the scholars in the Tafsirs says overrides what you and I say. No I dont have the Arabic tafsirs but what I quoted are the authentic English versions of the Tafsirs. In the Tafsirs when they say &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; they mean &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; and that is true whether it is Arabic or english. One of the Tafsir explains why its wrong to interpret that as &#039;a man and a woman&#039; and it is in fact &#039;two men&#039;. (1) Did you see that explanation? When the Quran says &amp;quot;The two&amp;quot; it is talking about &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; as the Tafsirs from two Islamic scholar explain.&lt;br /&gt;
: (2) Why do you think this verse is saying something new that everything else on that page is not saying? Other Quranic verses and what hadiths say about a topic has to be considered to find out what the meanings are or what Islam says about a topic. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 02:55, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
::Additional translations for &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; [http://quranx.com/4.16]&lt;br /&gt;
:::Ahmad Ali: If two (men) among you are guilty of such acts then punish both of them. But if they repent and reform, let them be, for God accepts repentance and is merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Talal Itani: If two men among you commit it, punish them both. But if they repent and reform, leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Full of Mercy.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Wahihuddin Khan: If two men commit a like abomination, punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, leave them alone. God is forgiving and merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
::--[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 03:11, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I found the Arabic versions of the tafsirs, and what I concluded is that most of the scholars (even the ones you mentioned) don&#039;t know certainly if it was meant for 2 men or a man and woman although some of them believe one of the meanings is more suitable than the other. For example, Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable because the pronoun used is for masculine. But I&#039;ll tell you that in Arabic if you want to refer to a group of people containing both men and women, you use the masculine pronoun, so it isn&#039;t a decisive clue that &amp;quot;2 men&amp;quot; is the meaning here. And I say again that the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; wasn&#039;t mentioned even once in this verse, so if someone, while translating, understands it from the meaning and it&#039;s not written, he should write it within parentheses (if he&#039;s sure) like what Ahmad Ali did. As for Tafsir Ibn-Kathir, he put up 3 possibilities of what the meaning would be, one of which means 2 men. The other tafsirs are mostly the same as these 2.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 03:35, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:This just proves again how false the Quran is when it makes the claim of being in detail and that &amp;quot;Nothing have we omitted from the Book&amp;quot;. A lot has been omitted from the book and a lot is unclear and could have been written in a more clear way. [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Lack_of_Detail_in_the_Quran#Claims_of_Detail]&lt;br /&gt;
:So indeed:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
:It is two men. As for your analysis, again what the two Tafsirs say overrides what you say. &amp;quot;Two men&amp;quot; may not have been mentioned but as the Tafsir says its &#039;&#039;most likely&#039;&#039; two men that the Quran is referring to. &lt;br /&gt;
:What do you think of the reasoning made in the first Tafsir quote?:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;but this [opinion of his] may be countered by the fact that [the reference to] the two [men] becomes clear on account of the particle min being attached to a masculine pronoun [minkum, ‘of you’], and by the fact that they suffer the same punishment, [both effect the action of] repentance and [are both granted] that they be left alone [thereafter], [all of] which applies specifically to men, given that for women detention is stipulated, as was stated before.&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
:Once again I ask you for the 3rd time: Do you think the &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; version of 4:16 goes against what has been said about the topic in other locations? That is all quoted on that [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality page] and this includes [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Qur.27an verses]. The topic of the people of Lut is mentioned in many places on that page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 04:25, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
No I don&#039;t. The point I&#039;m talking about is if &amp;quot;this&amp;quot; and only this verse is talking about 2 men or not, not if the whole thing about homosexuality is true or not. You&#039;re saying the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t as clear and detailed as it claims to be. Hell, if you want it to be clearer and more detailed than that, do you want a 20000-page book that no one can read? God claims the Qur&#039;an is clear and detailed, and indeed it is. He doesn&#039;t say each and every verse has an independent meaning that could be clearly understood while standing alone, but the Qur&#039;an as a whole stands tall, with each verse clarifying the other ones if necessary. Now, if people can understand a verse, then there&#039;s no need to clarify it with other verses, making a 603-page book even bigger. Now, as you can read from Tafsirs, we can infer from other verses and Hadiths the punishments of adultery or homosexuality and apply it here to understand the meaning clearly. So even if you still don&#039;t know the partial meaning of the verse (if it&#039;s 2 or 2 men), you clearly and fully understand the complete meaning of the subject in hand, so what do you want more? Anyway, let&#039;s continue, you again quoted the Grammatical reasoning that was made to prove it, which I already talked about in the last edit. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 05:40, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107703</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107703"/>
		<updated>2014-05-30T12:40:33Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:What recognized translations say and what the scholars in the Tafsirs says overrides what you and I say. No I dont have the Arabic tafsirs but what I quoted are the authentic English versions of the Tafsirs. In the Tafsirs when they say &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; they mean &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; and that is true whether it is Arabic or english. One of the Tafsir explains why its wrong to interpret that as &#039;a man and a woman&#039; and it is in fact &#039;two men&#039;. (1) Did you see that explanation? When the Quran says &amp;quot;The two&amp;quot; it is talking about &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; as the Tafsirs from two Islamic scholar explain.&lt;br /&gt;
: (2) Why do you think this verse is saying something new that everything else on that page is not saying? Other Quranic verses and what hadiths say about a topic has to be considered to find out what the meanings are or what Islam says about a topic. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 02:55, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
::Additional translations for &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; [http://quranx.com/4.16]&lt;br /&gt;
:::Ahmad Ali: If two (men) among you are guilty of such acts then punish both of them. But if they repent and reform, let them be, for God accepts repentance and is merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Talal Itani: If two men among you commit it, punish them both. But if they repent and reform, leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Full of Mercy.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Wahihuddin Khan: If two men commit a like abomination, punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, leave them alone. God is forgiving and merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
::--[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 03:11, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I found the Arabic versions of the tafsirs, and what I concluded is that most of the scholars (even the ones you mentioned) don&#039;t know certainly if it was meant for 2 men or a man and woman although some of them believe one of the meanings is more suitable than the other. For example, Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable because the pronoun used is for masculine. But I&#039;ll tell you that in Arabic if you want to refer to a group of people containing both men and women, you use the masculine pronoun, so it isn&#039;t a decisive clue that &amp;quot;2 men&amp;quot; is the meaning here. And I say again that the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; wasn&#039;t mentioned even once in this verse, so if someone, while translating, understands it from the meaning and it&#039;s not written, he should write it within parentheses (if he&#039;s sure) like what Ahmad Ali did. As for Tafsir Ibn-Kathir, he put up 3 possibilities of what the meaning would be, one of which means 2 men. The other tafsirs are mostly the same as these 2.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 03:35, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:This just proves again how false the Quran is when it makes the claim of being in detail and that &amp;quot;Nothing have we omitted from the Book&amp;quot;. A lot has been omitted from the book and a lot is unclear and could have been written in a more clear way. [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Lack_of_Detail_in_the_Quran#Claims_of_Detail]&lt;br /&gt;
:So indeed:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
:It is two men. As for your analysis, again what the two Tafsirs say overrides what you say. &amp;quot;Two men&amp;quot; may not have been mentioned but as the Tafsir says its &#039;&#039;most likely&#039;&#039; two men that the Quran is referring to. &lt;br /&gt;
:What do you think of the reasoning made in the first Tafsir quote?:&lt;br /&gt;
::&#039;&#039;but this [opinion of his] may be countered by the fact that [the reference to] the two [men] becomes clear on account of the particle min being attached to a masculine pronoun [minkum, ‘of you’], and by the fact that they suffer the same punishment, [both effect the action of] repentance and [are both granted] that they be left alone [thereafter], [all of] which applies specifically to men, given that for women detention is stipulated, as was stated before.&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
:Once again I ask you for the 3rd time: Do you think the &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; version of 4:16 goes against what has been said about the topic in other locations? That is all quoted on that [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality page] and this includes [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Qur.27an verses]. The topic of the people of Lut is mentioned in many places on that page. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 04:25, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
No I don&#039;t. The point I&#039;m talking about is if &amp;quot;this&amp;quot; and only this verse is talking about 2 men or not, not if the whole thing about homosexuality is true or not. You&#039;re saying the Qur&#039;an isn&#039;t as clear and detailed as it claims to be. Hell, if you want it to be clearer and more detailed than that, do you want a 20000-page book that no one can read? God claims the Qur&#039;an is clear and detailed, and indeed it is. He doesn&#039;t say each and every verse has an independent meaning that could be clearly understood while standing alone, but the Qur&#039;an as a whole stands tall, with each verse clarifying the other ones if necessary. Now, if people can understand a verse, then there&#039;s no need to clarify it with other verses, making a 603-page book even bigger. Now, as you can read from Tafsirs, we can infer from other verses and Hadiths the punishments of adultery or homosexuality and apply it here to understand the meaning clearly. So even if you still don&#039;t know the partial meaning of the verse (if it&#039;s 2 or 2 men), you clearly and fully understand the complete meaning of the subject in hand, so what do you want more? Anyway, let&#039;s continue, you again quoted the Grammatical reasoning that was made to prove it, which I already talked about in the last edit.&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107695</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107695"/>
		<updated>2014-05-30T10:35:12Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:What recognized translations say and what the scholars in the Tafsirs says overrides what you and I say. No I dont have the Arabic tafsirs but what I quoted are the authentic English versions of the Tafsirs. In the Tafsirs when they say &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; they mean &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; and that is true whether it is Arabic or english. One of the Tafsir explains why its wrong to interpret that as &#039;a man and a woman&#039; and it is in fact &#039;two men&#039;. (1) Did you see that explanation? When the Quran says &amp;quot;The two&amp;quot; it is talking about &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; as the Tafsirs from two Islamic scholar explain.&lt;br /&gt;
: (2) Why do you think this verse is saying something new that everything else on that page is not saying? Other Quranic verses and what hadiths say about a topic has to be considered to find out what the meanings are or what Islam says about a topic. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 02:55, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
::Additional translations for &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; [http://quranx.com/4.16]&lt;br /&gt;
:::Ahmad Ali: If two (men) among you are guilty of such acts then punish both of them. But if they repent and reform, let them be, for God accepts repentance and is merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Talal Itani: If two men among you commit it, punish them both. But if they repent and reform, leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Full of Mercy.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Wahihuddin Khan: If two men commit a like abomination, punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, leave them alone. God is forgiving and merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
::--[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 03:11, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I found the Arabic versions of the tafsirs, and what I concluded is that most of the scholars (even the ones you mentioned) don&#039;t know certainly if it was meant for 2 men or a man and woman although some of them believe one of the meanings is more suitable than the other. For example, Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable because the pronoun used is for masculine. But I&#039;ll tell you that in Arabic if you want to refer to a group of people containing both men and women, you use the masculine pronoun, so it isn&#039;t a decisive clue that &amp;quot;2 men&amp;quot; is the meaning here. And I say again that the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; wasn&#039;t mentioned even once in this verse, so if someone, while translating, understands it from the meaning and it&#039;s not written, he should write it within parentheses (if he&#039;s sure) like what Ahmad Ali did. As for Tafsir Ibn-Kathir, he put up 3 possibilities of what the meaning would be, one of which means 2 men. The other tafsirs are mostly the same as these 2.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 03:35, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107694</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107694"/>
		<updated>2014-05-30T10:34:43Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
:What recognized translations say and what the scholars in the Tafsirs says overrides what you and I say. No I dont have the Arabic tafsirs but what I quoted are the authentic English versions of the Tafsirs. In the Tafsirs when they say &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; they mean &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; and that is true whether it is Arabic or english. One of the Tafsir explains why its wrong to interpret that as &#039;a man and a woman&#039; and it is in fact &#039;two men&#039;. (1) Did you see that explanation? When the Quran says &amp;quot;The two&amp;quot; it is talking about &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; as the Tafsirs from two Islamic scholar explain.&lt;br /&gt;
: (2) Why do you think this verse is saying something new that everything else on that page is not saying? Other Quranic verses and what hadiths say about a topic has to be considered to find out what the meanings are or what Islam says about a topic. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 02:55, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
::Additional translations for &amp;quot;two men&amp;quot; [http://quranx.com/4.16]&lt;br /&gt;
:::Ahmad Ali: If two (men) among you are guilty of such acts then punish both of them. But if they repent and reform, let them be, for God accepts repentance and is merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Talal Itani: If two men among you commit it, punish them both. But if they repent and reform, leave them alone. God is Redeemer, Full of Mercy.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
:::Wahihuddin Khan: If two men commit a like abomination, punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, leave them alone. God is forgiving and merciful.&lt;br /&gt;
::--[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 03:11, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I found the Arabic versions of the tafsirs, and what I concluded is that most of the scholars (even the ones you mentioned) don&#039;t know certainly if it was meant for 2 men or a man and woman although some of them believe one of the meanings is more suitable than the other. For example, Tafsir Ibn Al-Jalalayn that you brought up talks about the 2 possibilities and then says that the 2nd possibility of the meaning being 2 men is more suitable because the pronoun used is for masculine. But I&#039;ll tell you that in Arabic if you want to refer to a group of people containing both men and women, you use the masculine pronoun, so it isn&#039;t a decisive clue that &amp;quot;2 men&amp;quot; is the meaning here. And I say again that the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot; wasn&#039;t mentioned even once in this verse, so if someone, while translating, understands it from the meaning and it&#039;s not written, he should write it within parentheses (if he&#039;s sure) like what Ahmad Ali did. As for Tafsir Ibn-Kathir, he put up 3 possibilities of what the meaning would be, one of which means 2 men. The other tafsirs are mostly the same as these 2.&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107684</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107684"/>
		<updated>2014-05-30T07:19:31Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word. By the way, do you have the tafsir in Arabic? I&#039;d like to check it. --[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107683</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107683"/>
		<updated>2014-05-30T07:17:59Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman And all people make mistakes, so it isn&#039;t weird if Yusuf Ali, based on a specific understanding of this verse, mistakenly added a word.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107682</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107682"/>
		<updated>2014-05-30T07:16:35Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107681</id>
		<title>User talk:Nightmare140</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=User_talk:Nightmare140&amp;diff=107681"/>
		<updated>2014-05-30T07:15:44Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Quran 4:16 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;==Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
You can make edits here for responses to that article: [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]]. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 10:32, 14 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Quran 4:16 ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That was Yusuf Ali, a famous translator. See [http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur%27an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Homosexuality#Tafsir_Quran_4_16 Tafsirs] that I just added. The other Quran verses (and hadiths and everything else on that page, quotes from scholars) are clear in saying that homosexuality is wrong/forbidden/punishable, so Quran 4:16 is not saying something new. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] &amp;lt;span style=&amp;quot;font-size:88%&amp;quot;&amp;gt;([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] &amp;lt;nowiki&amp;gt;|&amp;lt;/nowiki&amp;gt; [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])&amp;lt;/span&amp;gt; 14:24, 29 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;br /&gt;
I didn&#039;t say homosexuality isn&#039;t wrong, but this verse doesn&#039;t include the word &amp;quot;men&amp;quot;. It says &amp;quot;the two&amp;quot; so it doesn&#039;t specify if its between 2 men or between a man and woman.--[[User:Nightmare140|Nightmare140]] ([[User talk:Nightmare140|talk]]) 00:15, 30 May 2014 (PDT)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Textual_History_of_the_Qur%27an&amp;diff=107471</id>
		<title>Textual History of the Qur&#039;an</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Textual_History_of_the_Qur%27an&amp;diff=107471"/>
		<updated>2014-05-16T04:26:44Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Diacritical Marks and Grammatical Mistakes */ I removed a claimed &amp;quot;grammatical error&amp;quot; because it&amp;#039;s not an error. In Arabic it&amp;#039;s decided if it&amp;#039;s sabi&amp;#039;een or sabi&amp;#039;oon based on what part of speech it is (I&amp;#039;m an Arab, I can explain more if needed)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;This article examines the [[Islam|Islamic]] claim that the [[Qur&#039;an]] is free from [[Corruption of Scripture|corruption]].&lt;br /&gt;
==Introduction== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an is claimed to be a revelation from [[Allah]] to Prophet [[Muhammad]] through the Angel [[Gabriel]]. It was revealed to Muhammad in stages, taking 23 years to reach its completion. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
At no time during Muhammad&#039;s life did he ever order these alleged revelations to be compiled into a single book.&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;Abu Bakr&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;...Therefore I suggest, you (Abu Bakr) order that the Qur&#039;an be collected.&amp;quot; I said to &#039;Umar, &amp;quot;How can you do something which Allah&#039;s Apostle did not do?&amp;quot; &#039;Umar said, &amp;quot;By Allah, that is a good project...&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Bukhari|6|61|509}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; If Muhammad was, as he claimed, a messenger to all mankind, it is perplexing as to why he never gave thought to the preservation of his message. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
His followers must solely take the credit of the Qur&#039;an&#039;s existence today and its spreading to people beyond those which Muhammad had initially subjugated. Muslims however would argue that the Qur&#039;an was preserved by Allah as he had promised.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;We have, without doubt, sent down the Message; and We will assuredly guard it (from corruption).&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Quran|15|9}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==The Evidence from Within== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
We can find evidence that suggests the Qur&#039;an was corrupted through many sources, but what is most striking is the evidence from the Qur&#039;an itself. The Qur&#039;an tells us &amp;quot;There were some among the Jews who &#039;&#039;pervert&#039;&#039; words from their proper places...&amp;quot;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;{{Qtt|4|46}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The word &amp;quot;pervert&amp;quot; in [[Arabic]] is &#039;&#039;Yuharifoon&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;corrupt&amp;quot;. Therefore, according to the Qur&#039;an, &#039;&#039;al-Tahreef&#039;&#039; (corruption) is achieved through changing words from their proper places. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Has the Qur&#039;an been subjected to such changes? Beyond a shadow of doubt, it has. If we read [[surah]] 5:3, it says &amp;quot;This day have I perfected your religion for you and completed My favour upon you and have chosen for you Islam as religion.&amp;quot;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;{{Quran|5|3}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This was quoted from chapter 5, and the Qur&#039;an contains 114 chapters in total. How can the religion of Islam be completed by chapter 5, when there are 109 chapters yet to come? If it was completed in chapter 5, then there is no need for the 109 chapters ahead. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some Muslims argue that this verse was the last verse revealed. If that is so, why then is it not placed at the conclusion? This proves that Muslims have changed the words from their right places, and according to the Qur&#039;an, that is &#039;&#039;Tahreef&#039;&#039; (Corruption). &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The first surah to be revealed was al-Alak, yet it is surah [[al-Fatiha]] which we find at the beginning of the Qur&#039;an. Instead, Muslims have placed the first chapter to be revealed (al-Alaq), as chapter 96, towards the end of the Qur&#039;an. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
How is this &#039;&#039;not&#039;&#039; the changing of words from their right places? This is indeed &#039;Tahreef&#039;. Muslims have not arranged the [[Chronological Order of the Qur&#039;an|surahs chronologically]]. They took it upon themselves to organize the [[revelations]] instead of Allah completing this task himself.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Could the Qur&#039;an have Been Preserved through Memorization?== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
We would say no, as Muhammad himself had forgotten portions of the Qur&#039;an and needed his followers to remind him.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Allah&#039;s Apostle heard a man reciting the Qur&#039;an at night, and said, &amp;quot;May Allah bestow His Mercy on him, as he has reminded me of such-and-such Verses of such-and-such Suras, which I was caused to forget.&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Bukhari|6|61|558}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; This led to him having a [[Muhammad&#039;s Just In Time Revelations|&amp;quot;just in time&amp;quot; revelation]]&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Whatever communications We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, We bring one better than it or like it...&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Quran|2|106}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; claiming that some verses were to be forgotten. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
What about the great memorizers of Islam from among the [[Salaf]], maybe they had successfully memorized it? Well, that would not work as an argument. The best, and most, of the Qurra&#039; (“reciters”) had died before its compilation.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;...Umar has come to me and said: &amp;quot;Casualties were heavy among the Qurra&#039; of the! Qur&#039;an (i.e. those who knew the Quran by heart) on the day of the Battle of Yalmama, and I am afraid that more heavy casualties may take place among the Qurra&#039; on other battlefields, whereby a large part of the Qur&#039;an may be lost...&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Bukhari|6|61|509}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; Abu Bakr even knew that the Qur&#039;an would be hard to collect&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;...Then Abu Bakr said (to me). &#039;You are a wise young man and we do not have any suspicion about you, and you used to write the Divine Inspiration for Allah&#039;s Apostle. So you should search for (the fragmentary scripts of) the Qur&#039;an and collect it in one book).&amp;quot; By Allah If they had ordered me to shift one of the mountains, it would not have been heavier for me than this ordering me to collect the Qur&#039;an...&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Bukhari|6|61|509}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; and that Muhammad had never ordered such an action to be taken.&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;Abu Bakr&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an in fact was &#039;&#039;not&#039;&#039; memorized in full by the [[Sahabah|companions]], and for proof of this we need only look to the words of Zaid bin Thabit, the companion who was charged with its collection. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
He had stated &amp;quot;I started looking for the Qur&#039;an and collecting it from (what was written on) palm-leaf stalks, thin white stones, and also from the men who knew it by heart, till I found the last verse of Surat at-Tauba (repentance) with Abi Khuzaima al-Ansari, and I did not find it with anybody other than him.&amp;quot;&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;Zaid bin Thabit&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;...I started looking for the Qur&#039;an and collecting it from (what was written on) palm-leaf stalks, thin white stones...&#039;&#039;&amp;quot;{{Bukhari|6|61|509}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Had the companions fully memorized it, why then would they look for verses in leafs and stones? Surah al-Taubah was found with one person only.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Disagreements on the Qur&#039;an and its Burning== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
During the [[Caliph|Caliphate]] of Uthman, he heard that many Muslims were arguing that they can recite the Qur&#039;an better, and they had differences between them.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;...Hudhaifa was afraid of their (the people of Sham and Iraq) differences in the recitation of the Qur&#039;an, so he said to &#039;Uthman, &amp;quot;O chief of the Believers! Save this nation before they differ about the Book (Quran) as Jews and the Christians did before...&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Bukhari|6|61|510}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Upon hearing this, Uthman hurriedly ordered the burning of both fragmentary manuscripts and whole copies of the Qur&#039;an&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;...&#039;Uthman sent to every Muslim province one copy of what they had copied, and ordered that all the other Qur&#039;anic materials, whether written in fragmentary manuscripts or whole copies, be burnt...&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Bukhari|6|61|510}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; and sent a message to Hafsa (one of [[Muhammad&#039;s Wives|Muhammad&#039;s wives]]) requesting the manuscripts she had in her possession.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;...Uthman sent a message to Hafsa saying, &amp;quot;Send us the manuscripts of the Qur&#039;an so that we may compile the Qur&#039;anic materials in perfect copies and return the manuscripts to you.&amp;quot; Hafsa sent it to &#039;Uthman....&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Bukhari|6|61|510}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; Making a codex from what Zayd bin thabit had originally compiled,&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;Zaid bin Thabit&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; he gave it to the people. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Even after the final recension of the Qur&#039;an during Uthman&#039;s reign, disputes still came to the fore in respect to the authenticity of the text. A very good example concerns a variant reading of Surah 2.238. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an as it stands today, reads &amp;quot;Maintain your prayers, particularly the middle prayer (as-salaatil wustaa), and stand before Allah in devoutness&amp;quot;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;{{Qtt|2|238}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The variant reading of this verse was given by [[Aisha]], according to whom, in this verse it says &#039;Asr Prayer&#039; (salaatiil &#039;asri).&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Abu Yunus, freedman of Aishah, Mother of Believers, reported: Aishah ordered me to transcribe the Holy Qur&#039;an and asked me to let her know when I should arrive at the verse Hafidhuu alaas-salaati waas-salaatiil-wustaa wa quumuu lillaahi qaanitiin (2.238). When I arrived at the verse I informed her and she ordered: Write it in this way, Hafidhuu alaas-salaati waas-salaatiil-wustaa wa salaatiil &#039;asri wa quumuu lillaahi qaanitiin. She added that she had heard it so from the Apostle of Allah.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - Muwatta Imam Malik, p.64&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; However, according to Hafsa&#039;s Codex,&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;It is reported by Abdullah on the authority of Muhammad ibn Abdul Malik who reported from Yazid (etc.) ... It is written in the codex of Hafsah, the widow of the Prophet (saw): &amp;quot;Observe your prayers, especially the middle prayer and the afternoon prayer&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - Ibn Abi Dawud, Kitab al-Masahif, p.87&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; this was never the case.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Abdullah bin Mas&#039;ud- Authority of the Qur&#039;an and Best Qur&#039;anic Teacher== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Muhammad ordered Muslims to learn the Qur&#039;an from four individuals and the first of them was Abdullah bin Mas&#039;ud.&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;bin Masud&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Narrated Masruq: Abdullah bin Mas&#039;ud was mentioned before Abdullah bin Amr who said, &amp;quot;That is a man I still love, as I heard the Prophet (saw) saying, &#039;Learn the recitation of the Qur&#039;an from four: from Abdullah bin Mas&#039;ud - he started with him - Salim, the freed slave of Abu Hudhaifa, Mu&#039;adh bin Jabal and Ubai bin Ka&#039;b&amp;quot;.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - Sahih al-Bukhari, Vol. 5, p.96&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; So, according to Muhammad, Ibn Mas&#039;ud was an authority on the Qur&#039;an. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn Mas&#039;ud swore that he knew all the surahs of the Qur&#039;an, saying &amp;quot;By Allah other than Whom none has the right to be worshipped! There is no Sura revealed in Allah&#039;s Book but I know at what place it was revealed; and there is no verse revealed in Allah&#039;s Book but I know about whom it was revealed. And if I know that there is somebody who knows Allah&#039;s Book better than I, and he is at a place that camels can reach, I would go to him&amp;quot;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Sahih al-Bukhari, Vol. 6, p.488&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That is quite a grandiose statement by Ibn Mas&#039;ud, which we cannot disagree with. After all, according to Muhammad&#039;s words, he was one of the chosen teachers whom Muslims were to go to when they desired to learn the Qur&#039;an. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
After Muhammad&#039;s choice of Abdullah bin Mas&#039;ud, he was followed by Salim, the freed slave of Abu Hudhaifa, Mu&#039;adh bin Jabal and Ubai bin Ka&#039;b.&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;bin Masud&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; What is odd is that we do not find any mention of Zayd Bin Thabit who was ultimately entrusted by Uthman with the task of collecting the Qur&#039;an from scraps. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Ibn Mas&#039;ud&#039;s Disagreement with Uthman== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an that Ibn Mas&#039;ud had was known and agreed upon by many Muslims. When Uthman ordered that all codices must be destroyed and that only Zayd&#039;s codex is to be preserved, The reaction of Abdallah ibn Masud was great. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;I have not led them [the people of Kufa] astray. There is no verse in the Book of Allah that I do not know where it was revealed and why it was revealed, and if I knew anyone more learned in the Book of Allah and I could be conveyed there, I would set out to him&amp;quot;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Hudhaifah went on to say, &amp;quot;0 Abdullah ibn Qais, you were sent to the people of Basra as their governor (amir) and teacher and they have submitted to your rules, your idioms and your reading&amp;quot;. He continued, &amp;quot;0 Abdullah ibn Mas&#039;ud, you were sent to the people of Kufa as their teacher who have also submitted to your rules, idioms and reading&amp;quot;. Abdullah said to him, &amp;quot;In that case I have not led them astray. There is no verse in the Book of Allah that I do not know where it was revealed and why it was revealed, and if I knew anyone more learned in the Book of Allah and I could be conveyed there, I would set out to him&amp;quot;.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - Ibn Abi Dawud, Kitab al-Masahif, p.14&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Referring to the authority given to Zaid bin thabit, Abdullah ibn Mas&#039;ud said, &amp;quot;I recited from the messenger of Allah (saw) seventy surahs which I had perfected before Zaid ibn Thabit had embraced Islam&amp;quot;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Ibn Abi Dawud, Kitab al-Masahif, p.17&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
When Uthman ordered the destruction of Ibn Mas&#039;ud&#039;s codex, Ibn Mas&#039;ud gave a sermon in Kufa and said &amp;quot;The people have been guilty of deceit in the reading of the Qur&#039;an. I like it better to read according to the recitation of him (Prophet) whom I love more than that of Zayd Ibn Thabit. By Him besides Whom there is no god! I learnt more than seventy surahs from the lips of the Apostle of Allah, may Allah bless him, while Zayd Ibn Thabit was a youth, having two locks and playing with the youth&amp;quot;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Ibn Sa&#039;d, Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir, Vol. 2, p.444&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Zaid bin thabit was in no place to be a rival to the great scholar and teacher Ibn Mas&#039;ud, and such sermons by him are devastating to the history of Islam and to the authenticity of the Qur&#039;an. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==What did Ibn Mas&#039;ud have in his Qur&#039;an that Uthman did not?==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn Mas&#039;ud&#039;s Qur&#039;anic text omitted surah al-Fatiha and the mu&#039;awwithatayni (surahs 113 and 114).&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Imam Fakhruddin said that the reports in some of the ancient books that Ibn Mas&#039;ud denied that Suratul-Fatiha and the Mu&#039;awwithatayni are part of the Qur&#039;an are embarrassing in their implications... But the Qadi Abu Bakr said &amp;quot;It is not soundly reported from him that they are not part of the Qur&#039;an and there is no record of such a statement from him. He omitted them from his manuscript as he did not approve of their being written. This does not mean he denied they were part of the Qur&#039;an. In his view the Sunnah was that nothing should be inscribed in the text (mushaf) unless so commanded by the Prophet (saw) ... and he had not heard that it had been so commanded.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - as-Suyuti, Al-Itqan fii Ulum al-Qur&#039;an, p.186&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;  &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
When we come to the rest of the Qur&#039;an, we find that there were numerous differences of reading between the texts of Zaid and Ibn Mas&#039;ud. The records in Ibn Abu Dawud&#039;s Kitab al-Masahif fill up no less than nineteen pages&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Kitab al-Masahif, pp. 54-73&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; and, from all the sources available, one can trace no less than 101 variants in the Suratul-Baqarah alone. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
We will provide you with the mention of just a few of the differences here in illustration of the nature of the variations between the texts: &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Surah 2:275 begins with the words &#039;&#039;Allathiina yaakuluunar-ribaa laa yaquumuuna&#039;&#039;, meaning &amp;quot;those who devour usury will not stand&amp;quot;. Ibn Mas&#039;ud&#039;s text had the same introduction but after the last word there was added the expression &#039;&#039;yawmal qiyaamati&#039;&#039;, that is, they would not be able to stand on the &amp;quot;Day of Resurrection&amp;quot;. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The variant is mentioned in Abu Ubaid&#039;s Kitab Fadhail al-Qur&#039;an.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;cf. Nِldeke, Geschichte, 3.63; Jeffery, Materials, p.31&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; The variant was also recorded in the codex of Talha ibn Musarrif, a secondary codex dependent on Ibn Mas&#039;ud&#039;s text, Taiha likewise being based at Kufa in Iraq where Ibn Mas&#039;ud was based as governor and where his codex was widely followed.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Jeffery, p.343&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Surah 5:91, in the standard text, contains the exhortation &#039;&#039;fasiyaamu thalaathati ayyaamin&#039;&#039;, meaning &amp;quot;fast for three days&amp;quot;. Ibn Mas&#039;ud&#039;s text had, after the last word, the adjective &#039;&#039;mutataabi&#039;aatin&#039;&#039;, meaning three &amp;quot;successive&amp;quot; days. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The variant derives from at-Tabari&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;7.19.11 - cf. Nِldeke, 3.66; Jeffery, p.40&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; and was also mentioned by Abu Ubaid. This variant reading was, significantly, found in Ubayy ibn Ka&#039;b&#039;s text as well&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Jeffery, p.129&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; and in the texts of Ibn Abbas&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Jeffery, p.199&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; and Ibn Mas&#039;ud&#039;s pupil Ar-Rabi ibn Khuthaim.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Jeffery, p.289&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an we have today was rejected by Ibn Masud, whom the prophet of Islam himself approved of. This tells us that the Qur&#039;an we have is not the word of Allah. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Ubay bin Ka&#039;b== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ubay ibn Ka&#039;b, one of the four which were singled-out by Muhammad,&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;bin Masud&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; was considered the best reciter of the Qur&#039;an.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Affan ibn Muslim informed us ... on the authority of Anas ibn Malik, he on the authority of the Prophet, may Allah bless him; he said: The best reader (of the Qur&#039;an) among my people is Ubayyi ibn Ka&#039;b.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - Ibn Sa&#039;d, Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir, Vol. 2, p.441 &amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; He was known as Sayidul Qura&#039; (The Master of Reciters). Umar the Caliph also agreed that Ubay was the best reciter.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Sahih al-Bukhari, Vol. 6, p.489&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ubay agreed with Ibn Mas&#039;ud and disagreed with Zayd on the following: &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
1. For the standard reading &#039;&#039;wa yush-hidullaaha&#039;&#039; in Surah 2:204 he read &#039;&#039;wa yastash-hidullaaha&#039;&#039;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;cf. Nِldeke 3.83; Jeffery, p.120&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;2. He omitted the words &#039;&#039;in khiftum&#039;&#039; from Surah 4:101.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;cf. Nِldeke 3.85; Jeffery, p.127&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;3. He read &#039;&#039;mutathab-thibiina&#039;&#039; for &#039;&#039;muthabthabiina&#039;&#039; in Surah 4:143.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;cf. Jeffery, p.127&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
There are a number of cases where whole clauses differed in his text. In Surah 5:48, where the standard text reads &#039;&#039;wa katabnaa &#039;alayhim fiiha&#039;&#039;, meaning &amp;quot;and We inscribed therein for them (the Jews)&amp;quot;, the reading of Ubayy ibn Ka&#039;b was &#039;&#039;wa anzalallaahu alaa banii Isra&#039;iila fiiha&#039;&#039;, meaning &amp;quot;and Allah sent down therein to the Children of Israel.&amp;quot;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;cf. Nِldeke 3.85; Jeffery, p.128&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
From Abu Ubaid we find that, whereas Surah 17:16 in the standard text reads &#039;&#039;amarnaa mutrafiihaa fafasaquu&#039;&#039;, Ubay read this clause &#039;&#039;ba&#039;athnaa akaabira mujri-miihaa fdmakaruu&#039;&#039;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;cf. Nِldeke 3.88; Jeffery, p.140&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
We know that, whereas Ibn Mas&#039;ud omitted two surahs (113 and 114) from his codex, Ubayy included two extra surahs, al-Hafd (the Haste)&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;You (alone) we worship, and to You (alone) we pray and lie prostrate, and to You (alone) we proceed and have descendants. We fear Your torture and hope for Your mercy. Truly Your torture will overtake the infidels.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - al-Hafd ([http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Miracle/ubay.html the Haste])&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; and al-Khal&#039; (the Separation).&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;O Allah, You (alone) we ask for help and forgiveness. We speak appreciatingly of Your goodness. Never do we disbelieve You. We repudiate and disbelieve anyone who follows immorality.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - al-Khal&#039; ([http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Miracle/ubay.html the Separation])&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;as-Suyuti, Al-Itqan, p.152-153&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==What is Missing from the Qur&#039;an== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Surah at-Tawba was originally equal to the length of al-Baqara, losing about 157 verses.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Malik says that several verses from chapter 9 (Sura of Repentance) have been dropped from the beginning. Among them is, ‘In the name of God the compassionate, the Merciful’ because it was proven that the length of Sura of Repentance was equal to the length of the Sura of the Cow.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; -  &amp;quot;The Itqan&amp;quot; by Suyuti Part 3, Page 184&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Abu Musa al-Ash&#039;ari, one of the early authorities on the Qur&#039;an text and a companion of Muhammad, claimed a surah which resembled at-Tawba in length and severity was forgotten and lost.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;We used to recite a surah which resembled in length and severity to (Surah) Bara&#039;at. I have, however, forgotten it with the exception of this which I remember out of it: &amp;quot;If there were two valleys full of riches, for the son of Adam, he would long for a third valley, and nothing would fill the stomach of the son of Adam but dust.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - Sahih Muslim, Vol. 2, p.501&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Abu Waqid al-Laithii, Muhammad recited to him the verse on &amp;quot;the greed of man&amp;quot; which read, &amp;quot;We sent down wealth to maintain prayer and deeds of charity, and if the son of Adam had a valley he would leave it in search for another like it and, if he got another like it, he would press on for a third, and nothing would satisfy the stomach of the son of Adam but dust, yet Allah is relenting towards those who relent.&amp;quot;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Abu Waqid al-Laithii said, &amp;quot;When the messenger of Allah (saw) received the revelation we would come to him and he would teach us what had been revealed. (I came) to him and he said &#039;It was suddenly communicated to me one day: Verily Allah says, ...&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - As-Suyuti, Al-Itqan fii Ulum al-Qur&#039;an, p.525&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; This verse is not found in today&#039;s Qur&#039;an.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The lost verse of Rajm ([[stoning]]) which read &amp;quot;The fornicators among the married men (ash-shaikh) and married women (ash-shaikhah), stone them as an exemplary punishment from Allah, and Allah is Mighty and Wise,&amp;quot;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;As-Suyuti, Al-Itqan fii Ulum al-Qur&#039;an, p.524&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; was originally found in Surah al-Ahzab&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;Umar said to me ‘How many verses are contained in the chapter of al-Ahzab?’ I said, ‘72 or 73 verses.’ He said it was almost as long as the chapter of the Cow, which contains 287 verses, and in it there was the verse of stoning.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - Al-Muttaqi ‘Ali bin Husam al-Din in his book “Mukhtasar Kanz al-’Ummal” printed on the margin of Musnad Ahmad ibn Hanbal, Volume 2, page 2, in his hadith about chapter 33&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This verse, along with verses regarding adult suckling, were written on a piece of paper and were lost when a goat ate them.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Musnad Ahmad bin Hanbal. vol. 6. page 269; Sunan Ibn Majah, page 626; Ibn Qutbah, Tawil Mukhtalafi &#039;l-Hadith (Cairo: Maktaba al-Kulliyat al-Azhariyya. 1966) page 310; As-Suyuti, ad-Durru &#039;l-Manthur, vol. 2. page 13&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; The loss of the stoning verse is confirmed by Caliph Umar in [[sahih]] hadith.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;...Umar b. Khattab sat on the pulpit of Allah&#039;s Messenger (may peace be upon him) and said: Verily Allah sent Muhammad (may peace be upon him) with truth and He sent down the Book upon him, and the verse of stoning was included in what was sent down to him. We recited it, retained it in our memory and understood it. Allah&#039;s Messenger (may peace be upon him) awarded the punishment of stoning to death (to the married adulterer and adulteress) and, after him, we also awarded the punishment of stoning, I am afraid that with the lapse of time, the people (may forget it) and may say: We do not find the punishment of stoning in the Book of Allah, and thus go astray by abandoning this duty prescribed by Allah. stoning is a duty laid down in Allah&#039;s Book for married men and women who commit adultery when proof is established, or it there is pregnancy, or a confession....&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - {{Muslim|17|4194}}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Alhajjaj changes the Uthmanic Qur&#039;an== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The text we have today is not even Uthman&#039;s Revised Version of the Qur&#039;an, but it incorporates changes by Al-Hajjaj Ibn Yusuf Al-Thakafi. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Al-Hajjaj Ibn Yusuf Al-Thakafi, who lived in the years AD 660-714, was a teacher of the Arabic language in the city of Taif. Then he joined the military and became the most powerful person during the reign of Caliph Abd al-Malik Ibn Marawan and after him his son al-Waleed Ibn Abd al-Malik. Because Al-Hajjaj taught Arabic, he gave himself the liberty to change several words of Caliph Uthman&#039;s Qur&#039;an, which is an indication that he did not believe that the Qur&#039;an was verbally inspired or was inscribed in a &amp;quot;tablet preserved.&amp;quot; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
For brevity&#039;s sake we will only mention a few of these changes: &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
1. In Surah Yunus 10:22, he changed the word &#039;&#039;yanshorokom&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;spread you,&amp;quot; to &#039;&#039;yousayerokom&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;makes you to go on.&amp;quot; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
2. In Surah Ash-Shuara 26:116, he changed the word &#039;&#039;Al-Mukhrageen&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;the cast out,&amp;quot; to &#039;&#039;Al-Margoomeen&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;those who are to be stoned [to death].&amp;quot; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
3. In Surah Ash-Shuara 26:167, he changed the word &#039;&#039;Min Al-Margoomeen&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;those who are to be stoned to death,&amp;quot; to &#039;&#039;Al-Mukhrageen&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;those who will assuredly be cast out.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
 &lt;br /&gt;
4. In Surah Muhammad 47:15, he changed the word &#039;&#039;yasen&#039;&#039;, which is poor Arabic to &#039;&#039;Asen&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;unpolluted.&amp;quot; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
5. In Surah al-Hadid 57:7, he changed the word &#039;&#039;wataqu&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;feared Allah,&amp;quot; to &#039;&#039;Wa-anfaqu&#039;&#039;, which means &amp;quot;spend in charity.&amp;quot; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
If you read Qur&#039;anic [[Tafsir]]s such as al-Jalalayn and others on these verses, you will notice that they will say that there are other readings of these words, proving that there was corruption. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Visit [http://web.archive.org/web/20070309000028/http://www.geocities.com/pentaur2001/index.html this] site to see the differences between Samarqand Codex and Uthmans Codex.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Differences in the Hafs and Warsh Texts==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Apart from other earlier variant text, there are two different texts of the Qur&#039;an currently in print, named after their respective 2nd-century transmitters Hafs (from Kufa) and Warsh (from Medina). &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Hafs text is the more common and used in most areas of the Islamic world. Warsh is used mainly in West and North-West Africa as well as by the Zaydiya in Yemen. Here are some of the differences: &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{| border=&amp;quot;1&amp;quot; cellspacing=&amp;quot;0&amp;quot; cellpadding=&amp;quot;5&amp;quot; align=&amp;quot;center&amp;quot; width = &amp;quot;60%&amp;quot; class=wikitable&lt;br /&gt;
! Surah   &lt;br /&gt;
! Hafs&lt;br /&gt;
! Warsh&lt;br /&gt;
! Notes&lt;br /&gt;
|-&lt;br /&gt;
|2:132   &lt;br /&gt;
|wawassa&lt;br /&gt;
|wa&#039;awsa&lt;br /&gt;
|Al-Dani mentions Abu `Ubayd saw wa&#039;awsa &lt;br /&gt;
in the imam, the mushaf `Uthman&lt;br /&gt;
|-&lt;br /&gt;
|3:133  &lt;br /&gt;
|wasari&#039;u&lt;br /&gt;
|sari&#039;u&lt;br /&gt;
|&lt;br /&gt;
|-&lt;br /&gt;
|5:54  &lt;br /&gt;
|yartadda&lt;br /&gt;
|yartadid &lt;br /&gt;
|Al-Dani quotes Abu `Ubayd saw yartadid in the imam &lt;br /&gt;
|-&lt;br /&gt;
|3:81   &lt;br /&gt;
|ataytukum&lt;br /&gt;
|ataynakum&lt;br /&gt;
|&lt;br /&gt;
|-&lt;br /&gt;
|2:259  &lt;br /&gt;
|nunshizuha&lt;br /&gt;
|nunshiruha&lt;br /&gt;
|&lt;br /&gt;
|-&lt;br /&gt;
|2:140   &lt;br /&gt;
|taquluna&lt;br /&gt;
|yaquluna&lt;br /&gt;
|&lt;br /&gt;
|}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Diacritical Marks and Grammatical Mistakes== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an was written without [[Diacritical Marks of the Qur&#039;an|diacritical marks]]. At the time of Muhammad, Arabic orthography was yet to develop into what we have known for centuries. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
For the early interpretors who added diacritical marks, to read the Qur&#039;an as it was originally written, would lead the reader to interpret and choose for themselves from the many possible meanings available. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Muslims began using diacritical marks because reading &amp;quot;errors&amp;quot; began to appear,&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&amp;quot;&#039;&#039;The companions (Muhammad’s friends or “Sahaba”) did not vocalize or provide diacritical points for the letters of the Qur’anic copies which they wrote, but later during the last part of the companions’ era, when reading errors came into being, they began to provide diacritical points for the copies of the Qur’an and to vocalize them. This was admissible by the authority of the majority of the scholars, though some of them disliked it. The truth is, it should not be disliked because the situation necessitated it, and the diacritical points distinguish the letters from each other while vocalization explains the grammatical inflection.&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; - Ibn Taymiyyah, &amp;quot;Sheik of the Muslims&amp;quot; vol. XII, pp. 576 and 586&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; and the differences this created had led to differences in Islamic law.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;As-Suyuti, Al-Itqan fii Ulum al-Qur&#039;an, p.226&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The following are just a few examples from among many grammatical &#039;&#039;mistakes&#039;&#039; which show that the Qur&#039;an is not flawless.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
1. &#039;&#039;Butunihi&#039;&#039; is a mistake in 16:66. It must be &#039;&#039;Butuniha&#039;&#039;, because it is referring to the plural (cattle). &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
2. &#039;&#039;Kon fayakoon&#039;&#039;, meaning &amp;quot;be and it is&amp;quot;, must be &#039;&#039;kon fakana&#039;&#039;, meaning &amp;quot;be and he was&amp;quot; in 3:59, because it refers to the past not present.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Corruption of Previous Scriptures==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Many Muslims erroneously believe that the Qur&#039;an claims the [[Corruption of Previous Scriptures (Qur&#039;an 2:79)|corruption of previous scriptures]]. However with this erroneous belief comes a new set of problems.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an says in 15:9, &amp;quot;We have revealed the &#039;&#039;dhikr&#039;&#039; (reminder) and we surely will preserve it,&amp;quot; but which &amp;quot;reminder&amp;quot; is Allah referring to, and who decided it only applied to Qur&#039;anic text? &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The [[Taurat]] and [[Injil]] are also referred to as &#039;&#039;dhikr&#039;&#039; in 21:48, 21:7, and 40:53-54. So if Allah could not protect these &#039;&#039;dhikrs&#039;&#039; as he promised in 15:9, how can we expect him to protect the last &#039;&#039;dhikr&#039;&#039;? &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Allah said he will preserve the &#039;&#039;dhikr&#039;&#039;, either he preserves all the &#039;&#039;dhikr&#039;&#039; (Taurat, Injil, and Qur&#039;an) or None.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Conclusion== &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
What have we learnt here? We have learnt that some verses are missing, some readings are different, and the very best scholars and reciters of Islam, whom Muhammad himself had approved of, rejected the Qur&#039;an of Uthman. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
What are we left with? We are left with a very human text, as prone to corruption as any other medieval text, and Muslims who deny this are left holding an untenable position.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Core Scripture}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==See Also==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Hub4|Corruption of Qur&#039;an|Corruption of the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==External Links==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.answering-islam.org/Gilchrist/Jam/index.html Jam&#039; Al-Qur&#039;an: The Codification of the Qur&#039;an Text] &#039;&#039;- A Comprehensive Study of the Original Collection of the Qur&#039;an Text and the Early Surviving Qur&#039;an Manuscripts&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==References==&lt;br /&gt;
{{Reflist|30em}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Qur&#039;an]]&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Disguised‎]]&lt;br /&gt;
{{page_title|Corruption of the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Naskh_(Abrogation)&amp;diff=107455</id>
		<title>Naskh (Abrogation)</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Naskh_(Abrogation)&amp;diff=107455"/>
		<updated>2014-05-15T12:15:13Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Verse 2:106 */&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&#039;&#039;&#039;Abrogation&#039;&#039;&#039; ([[Abrogation|Naskh]]) refers to one [[Qur&#039;an|Qur&#039;anic]] verse superseding another, and is itself supported by Qur&#039;anic verses and various [[hadith]] narrations. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Introduction==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Understanding the necessity for Naskh is crucial in understanding [[Islam]] and its theology. The Qur&#039;an is said to have been revealed by the angel [[Gabriel|Jibreel]] to Prophet [[Muhammad]] over a period of twenty-three years.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&#039;&#039;Living Religions: An Encyclopaedia of the World&#039;s Faiths,&#039;&#039; Mary Pat Fisher, 1997, page 338,  I.B. Tauris Publishers, &amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;{{Quran|17|106}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; During those years, a lot had changed in his personal and private life. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Muhammad began as a preacher, and ended his life as the founder and Head of the first Islamic state, so it is not surprising that the style and message of [[:Category:Medinan Surah|later Medinan]] Qur&#039;anic revelations changed and often conflicted with [[:Category:Meccan Surah|earlier Meccan]] ones. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Today&#039;s Qur&#039;an, when read at face value with its non-chronological organization, can support any number of views on several subjects, and when read as a whole, many [[surah]]s clearly contradict one another. This is why Muhammad himself (through Qur&#039;anic [[revelations]]) introduced this concept into Islam. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
At the time of the [[Caliph|caliphate]], some scholars (particularly a preacher from Kufa, [[Iraq]]) were banned from explaining and preaching the Qur&#039;an by early &#039;ilmic authority figure (usually &#039;Alī but sometimes also Ibn &#039;Abbās) because of their ignorance of the principles of naskh.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Powers, &#039;&#039;The Exegetical Genre nāsikh al-Qur&#039;ān wa mansūkhuhu&#039;&#039;, ISBN 0-19-826546-8, p. 124&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Andrew Rippin, &#039;&#039;Bulletin of the School of Oriental and African Studies&#039;&#039; 47,  ISSN 0041-977X, pp. 26, 38&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some may claim this doctrine does not exist or is not a part of mainstream Islam. However, when you view the [[Chronological Order of the Qur&#039;an|chronological order]] of the revelations, it becomes undeniable. Moreover, Muslims adhere to this doctrine everyday by prohibiting the consumption of [[alcohol]].&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verse 2:106===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://islamawakened.org/quran/2/106/default.htm Qur&#039;an Text/Transliteration 2:106] |2=&#039;&#039;&#039;Arabic:&#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;lt;font size=&amp;quot;4&amp;quot;&amp;gt;ماننسخ من آية أو ننسها نأت بخير منها أو مثلها ألم تعلم أن الله على كل شيء قدير &amp;lt;/font&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Transliteration:&#039;&#039;&#039; &#039;&#039;Ma nansakh min ayatin aw nunsiha na/ti bikhayrin minha aw mithliha alam taaalam anna Allaha aala kulli shay-in qadeerun&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Shakir:&#039;&#039;&#039; Whatever communications We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, We bring one better than it or like it. Do you not know that Allah has power over all things?}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Meaning of Verse 2:106====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=2&amp;amp;tid=2938 The Meaning of Naskh]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir ibn Kathir|2=&#039;&#039;&#039;The Meaning of Naskh&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn Abi Talhah said that Ibn `Abbas said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;Whatever an Ayah We abrogate.&#039;&#039; Also, Ibn Jurayj said that Mujahid said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;Whatever an Ayah We erase.&#039;&#039; Also, Ibn Abi Najih said that Mujahid said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;We keep the words, but change the meaning.&#039;&#039; He related these words to the companions of `Abdullah bin Mas`ud. Ibn Abi Hatim said that similar statements were mentioned by Abu Al-`Aliyah and Muhammad bin Ka`b Al-Qurazi. Also As-Suddi said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;We erase it.&#039;&#039; Further, Ibn Abi Hatim said that it means, &amp;quot;Erase and raise it, such as erasing the following wordings (from the Qur&#039;an), `The married adulterer and the married adulteress: stone them to death,&#039; and, `If the son of Adam had two valleys of gold, he would seek a third.&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn Jarir stated that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;Whatever ruling we repeal in an Ayah by making the allowed unlawful and the unlawful allowed.&#039;&#039; The Nasakh only occurs with commandments, prohibitions, permissions, and so forth. As for stories, they do not undergo Nasakh. The word, `Nasakh&#039; literally means, `to copy a book&#039;. The meaning of Nasakh in the case of commandments is removing the commandment and replacing it by another. And whether the Nasakh involves the wordings, the ruling or both, it is still called Nasakh.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Allah said next,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(or Nunsiha (cause it to be forgotten)). `Ali bin Abi Talhah said that Ibn `Abbas said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh or Nunsiha) means, &amp;quot;Whatever Ayah We repeal or uphold without change.&#039;&#039; Also, Mujahid said that the companions of Ibn Mas`ud (who read this word Nansa&#039;ha) said that it means, &amp;quot;We uphold its wording and change its ruling.&#039;&#039; Further, `Ubayd bin `Umayr, Mujahid and `Ata&#039; said, `Nansa&#039;ha&#039; means, &amp;quot;We delay it (i.e., do not abrogate it).&#039;&#039; Further, `Atiyyah Al-`Awfi said that the Ayah means, &amp;quot;We delay repealing it.&#039;&#039; This is the same Tafsir provided by As-Suddi and Ar-Rabi` bin Anas. `Abdur-Razzaq said that Ma`mar said that Qatadah said about Allah&#039;s statement,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten) &amp;quot;Allah made His Prophet forget what He willed and He abrogated what He will.&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Allah&#039;s said,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one or similar to it), better, relates to the benefit provided for the one it addresses, as reported from `Ali bin Abi Talhah that Ibn `Abbas said,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one) means, &amp;quot;We bring forth a more beneficial ruling, that is also easier for you.&#039;&#039; Also, As-Suddi said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one or similar to it) means, &amp;quot;We bring forth a better Ayah, or similar to that which was repealed.&#039;&#039; Qatadah also said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one or similar to it) means, &amp;quot;We replace it by an Ayah more facilitating, permitting, commanding, or prohibiting.&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verse 13:39===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|13|39}}|Allah doth blot out or confirm what He pleaseth: with Him is the Mother of the Book.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verse 16:101===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|101}}|And when We change (one) communication for (another) communication, and Allah knows best what He reveals, they say: You are only a forger. Nay, most of them do not know.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verses 17:85-86===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|17|85|86}}|They ask thee concerning the Spirit (of inspiration). Say: &amp;quot;The Spirit (cometh) by command of my Lord: of knowledge it is only a little that is communicated to you, (O men!)&amp;quot; If it were Our Will, We could take away that which We have sent thee by inspiration:then wouldst thou find none to plead thy affair in that matter as against Us,-}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verses 87:6-7===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|87|6|7}}|By degrees shall We teach thee to declare (the Message), so thou shalt not forget, Except as Allah wills: For He knoweth what is manifest and what is hidden.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Hadith==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sahih Bukhari===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The following [[sahih]] narration indicates their are many verses in the Qur&#039;an that have been abrogated, but all of them had to be included.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|53}}|I said to &#039;Uthman bin &#039;Affan (while he was collecting the Qur&#039;an) regarding the Verse:-- &amp;quot;Those of you who die and leave wives ...&amp;quot; (2.240) &amp;quot;&#039;&#039;&#039;This Verse was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by an other Verse. So why should you write it? (Or leave it in the Qur&#039;an)?&amp;quot; &#039;Uthman said. &amp;quot;O son of my brother! I will not shift anything of it from its place.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|33}}|They had a choice, either fast or feed a poor for every day..&amp;quot; and added, &amp;quot;This Verse is &#039;&#039;&#039;abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039;.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|32}}|That he heard Ibn &#039;Abbas reciting the Divine Verse:--&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;And for those who can fast they had a choice either fast, or feed a poor for every day..&amp;quot; (2.184) Ibn &#039;Abbas said, &amp;quot;This Verse is not abrogated, but it is meant for old men and old women who have no strength to fast, so they should feed one poor person for each day of fasting (instead of fasting).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|34}}|&amp;quot;For those who can fast, they had a choice either fast, or feed a poor for every day,&amp;quot; (2.184) was revealed, it was permissible for one to give a ransom and give up fasting, till the Verse succeeding it was revealed and abrogated it.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|54}}|&#039;Ata said: Ibn &#039;Abbas said, &amp;quot;This Verse, i.e. the Statement of Allah: &amp;quot;..without turning them out..&amp;quot; &#039;&#039;&#039;cancelled the obligation&#039;&#039;&#039; of staying for the waiting period in her dead husband&#039;s house, and she can complete this period wherever she likes}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|68}}|This Verse:--&amp;quot;Whether you show what is in your minds or conceal it..&amp;quot; (2.284) &#039;&#039;&#039;was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|69}}|A man from the companions of Allah&#039;s Apostle who I think, was Ibn &#039;Umar said, &amp;quot;The Verse:-- ‘Whether you show what is in your minds or conceal it ...’ &#039;&#039;&#039;was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by the Verse following it.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sahih Muslim===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|003|0675}}|The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) abrogated some of his commands by others, &#039;&#039;&#039;just as the Qur&#039;an abrogates&#039;&#039;&#039; some part with the other.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|4|1317}}|Al-Bara&#039; b. &#039;Azib reported: This verse was revealed (in this way): &amp;quot;Guard the prayers and the &#039;Asr prayer.&amp;quot; We recited it (in this very way) so long as Allah desired. Allah, then, abrogated it and it was revealed: &amp;quot;Guard the prayers, and the middle prayer.&amp;quot; A person who was sitting with Shaqiq (one of the narrators in the chain of transmitters) said: Now it implies the &#039;Asr prayer. Upon this al-Bara&#039; said: I have already informed you how this (verse) was revealed and how &#039;&#039;&#039;Allah abrogated it&#039;&#039;&#039;, and Allah knows best. Imam Muslim said: Ashja&#039;i narrated it from Sufyan al-Thauri, who narrated it from al-Aswad b. Qais, who narrated it from &#039;Uqba, who narrated it from al-Bara&#039; b. &#039;Azib who said: We recited with the Prophet (may peace be upon him) (the above-mentioned verse like this, i. e. instead of Salat al- Wusta, Salat al-&#039;Asr) for a certain period, as it has been mentioned (in the above-quoted hadith).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|4|1433}}|Anas b. Malik reported that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) invoked curse in the morning (prayer) for thirty days upon those who killed the Companions (of the Holy Prophet) at Bi&#039;r Ma&#039;una. He cursed (the tribes) of Ri&#039;l, Dhakwan, Lihyan, and Usayya, who had disobeyed Allah and His Messenger (may peace be upon him). Anas said: Allah the Exalted and Great revealed (a verse) regarding those who were killed at Bi&#039;r Ma&#039;una, and we recited it, till it was abrogated later on (and the verse was like this):, convey to it our people the tidings that we have met our Lord, and He was pleased with us and we were pleased with Him&amp;quot;.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|43|7173}}|Sa&#039;id b. Jubair reported: I said to Ibn Abbas: Will the repentance of that person be accepted who kills a believer intentionally? He said: No. I recited to him this verse of Sura al-Furqan (xix.): &amp;quot;And those who call not upon another god with Allah and slay not the soul which Allah has forbidden except in the cause of justice&amp;quot; to the end of the verse. He said: This is a Meccan verse which has been abrogated by a verse revealed at Medina: &amp;quot;He who slays a believer intentionally, for him is the requital of Hell-Fire where he would abide for ever,&amp;quot; and in the narration of Ibn Hisham (the words are): I recited to him this verse of Sura al-Furqan: &amp;quot;Except one who made repentance.&amp;quot; (see also Sahih al-Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 285)}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Abu Dawud===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Abudawud|5|1299}}|In Surat al-Muzzammil (73), the verse: &amp;quot;Keep vigil at night but a little, a half thereof&amp;quot; (2-3) &#039;&#039;&#039;has been abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by the following verse: &amp;quot;He knoweth that ye count it not, and turneth unto you in mercy. Recite then of the Qur&#039;an that which is easy for you&amp;quot; (v.20). The phrase &amp;quot;the vigil of the night&amp;quot; (nashi&#039;at al-layl) means the early hours of the night. They (the companions) would pray (the tahajjud prayer) in the early hours of the night.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Abudawud|1|1300}}|Ibn ‘Abbas said: When the opening verses of Surah asl-muzzammil (lxxiii.), were revealed, the Companions would pray as long as they would pray during Ramadan &#039;&#039;&#039;until its last verses were revealed&#039;&#039;&#039;.}} &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Abudawud|12|2275}}|Women who are divorced shall wait, keeping themselves apart, three monthly courses; and then said: And for such of your women as despair of menstruation, if ye doubt, their period (of waiting) shall be three months. &#039;&#039;&#039;This was abrogated from the former verse&#039;&#039;&#039;. Again he said: (O ye who believe, if ye wed believing women) and divorce them before ye have touched them, then there is no period that ye should reckon.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Al Muwatta===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Neither the abrogating nor the abrogated verses on suckling appear in the text of the Qur&#039;an today. This, along with the Qur&#039;anic [[Stoning|verse of rajm]] (stoning), were written on a piece of paper and were reportedly lost when a goat [[Qur&#039;an, Hadith and Scholars:Stoning|ate them]].&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Musnad Ahmad bin Hanbal. vol. 6. page 269; Sunan Ibn Majah, page 626; Ibn Qutbah, Tawil Mukhtalafi &#039;l-Hadith (Cairo: Maktaba al-Kulliyat al-Azhariyya. 1966) page 310; As-Suyuti, ad-Durru &#039;l-Manthur, vol. 2. page 13&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muwatta|30|3|17}}|Yahya related to me from Malik from Abdullah ibn Abi Bakr ibn Hazm from Amra bint Abd ar-Rahman that A&#039;isha, the wife of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, said, &amp;quot;Amongst what was sent down of the Qur&#039;an was &#039;ten known sucklings make haram&#039; - &#039;&#039;&#039;then it was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by &#039;five known sucklings&#039;. When the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, died, it was what is now recited of the Qur&#039;an.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Yahya said that Malik said, &amp;quot;One does not act on this.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muwatta|37|5|4b}}|&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Yahya said that he heard Malik say, &amp;quot;This ayat is abrogated. It is the word of Allah, the Blessed, the Exalted, &#039;If he leaves goods, the testament is for parents and kinsmen.&#039; What came down about the division of the fixed shares of inheritance in the Book of Allah, the Mighty, the Exalted, &#039;&#039;&#039;abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; it&amp;quot; ...}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Ibn Majah===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Ibn Majah Vol. 3, Book 9, Hadith 1942|It was narrated that &#039;Aishah said:&lt;br /&gt;
 &lt;br /&gt;
“Once of the things that &#039;&#039;&#039;Allah revealed in the the Qur&#039;an and then abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; was that nothing makes marriage prohibited except ten breastfeedings or five well-known (breastfeedings).” (Sahih)}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Scholars==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Companions of Muhammad===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Ali, the fourth Rightly-guided Caliph, knowing the difference between abrogating and abrogated verses will save you from being damned.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote||Ali [&#039;Ali ibn Abi Talib]said to Abdul Rahman “can you differentiate between abrogating and abrogated verses” Abdul Rahman said, “no.” Thereupon Ali said “Thou art damned and causeth others to be damned.”&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&#039;&#039;Annasikh-wal-Mansukh&#039;&#039;, by Abul Qasim, published by Hindia Press, Cairo, p. 6. A similar saying is found in &#039;&#039;An-Nasikh -wal- Mansukh &#039;&#039;(i.e. Abrogating &amp;amp; Abrogated), by Abu Ja&#039;afar An-Nah&#039;has, Beirut, 2003, p. 9, and &#039;&#039;Nawasikh Al-Qur&#039;an&#039;&#039; (i.e. The Abrogating of the Qur&#039;an), by Ibn Al-Jauzy, Beirut 2002, p. 24, and &#039;&#039;Al-Itqan Fi Ulum Al Qur&#039;an&#039;&#039; by Al-Suyuti, II, p. 700.&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote||&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;Although the companions of Muhammad are reported to have discussed naskh, and even to have disagreed over the abrogation of a particular verse, references to the generation of the companions in the naskh literature are relatively infrequent.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Ibn Salama, al-Nasikh wa ‘l-mansukh (Cairo 1315/1899), 142-3, where `Ali and Ibn ‘Abbas disagree over the abrogation of Quran 4:94; `Ali maintained that the verse was abrogated by Quran 4:115 and 4:48, while Ibn ‘Abbas held that it remained muhkama.&#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;A.Rippin&amp;quot;&amp;gt;(referenced by A.Rippin) [http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/abrogation-and-the-koran/ Abrogation and the Koran] - David Bukay, School of Political Science, The University of Haifa&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Early Scholars===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote||&amp;quot;The number of verses that are considered to have been abrogated increased dramatically between the eighth and eleventh centuries (al-Zuhri mentions 42 abrogated verses, al-Nahhas 138, and Ibn Salama, 238), at which point an upper limit seems to have been reached (Ibn ‘Ata’iqi identifies 231 abrogated verses, and al-Farsi, 248). &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
- &amp;quot;al-Suyuti (d. 911/1505) recognised only twenty [20] instances of true abrogation and Shah Wali Allah (d 1762) reduced that number to five [5].&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;these figures are mentioned in Ernest Hahn, ‘Sir Sayyid Ahmad Khan’s The Controversy over Abrogation (in the Qur’an)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn al-’Ata’iqi, on the other hand, while citing 231 instances of abrogation, appendixes the phrase wa fihi nazar, indicating doubt or uncertainty to his discussion of twenty-six verses.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
.....&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
- &amp;quot;There is also considerable disagreement over the scope of abrogation within the Qur’an itself. At one extreme, there were apparently certain people who argued that ‘the Qur’an does not contain either an abrogated or an abrogating verse’.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(&amp;quot;Ibn Salama, p. 26; cf. Al-Nahhas, pp 2-3&amp;quot;), these people, according to Ibn Salama, ‘&#039;&#039;&#039;have deviated from the truth&#039;&#039;&#039; and by virtue of their lying, have turned away from God’. (&amp;quot;Ibn Salama, p. 26)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
At the other extreme were those scholars who maintained that any narrative, positive command, or prohibition in the Qur’an may be abrogated.&amp;quot; (&amp;quot;Al-Nahhas, pp. 2-3&amp;quot;)&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;A.Rippin&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Ibn Salma , those who reject abrogation have deviated from the truth. Once again, its improtant to note at the time of the caliphate, some scholars (particularly a preacher from Kufa, Iraq) were banned from explaining and preaching the Qur&#039;ān by early &#039;ilmic authority figures because of their ignorance of the principles of naskh.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Modern Scholars===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://mac.abc.se/home/onesr/ez/in/it1/Abrogation_Hadith.txt Abrogation and Hadith]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Shaykh Gibril Fouad Haddad, living islam, December 23, 2008|Naskh is a fact since Allah Most High said &amp;quot;We do not erase (nansakh) any aya or cause it to be forgotten (nunsiha) but bring a better one or the like of it&amp;quot; (2:106).&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Second, the mutual abrogability of the Qur&#039;an and the Sunna (i) is rationally possible - since the Qur&#039;an describes the Sunna as revealed as well: &amp;quot;Nor does he speak of his own desire&amp;quot; (53:3) - and &lt;br /&gt;
(ii) occurs in the Law, as per the abrogation of the verse of bequest (2:180) by the mass-transmitted hadith &amp;quot;There is no bequest for anyone who stands to inherit.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Imam al-Shafi`i famously dissented with the massive majority of the Scholars when he said that only the Qur&#039;an abrogates the Qur&#039;an and only the Sunna abrogates the Sunna, but his School did not follow him in this cf. Imam al-Haramayn in Mughith al-Khalq and the contemporary Shaykh Hasan Hitu in al-Wajiz fi Usul al-Tashri` al-Islami, both staunch Shafi`is.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
We should be aware that in recent times the tendency has been toward minimalism, much of it a reaction to Orientalist and other attempts to construe naskh as a literary rewrite invalidating Divine origin, some Muslim revisionists even forwarding the view that there is no &lt;br /&gt;
abrogation in the Qur&#039;an. However, of the 60-odd teatises written on abrogation there is no precedent for such an extreme view. The number of cases hovers around 200, peaking at 247 with Ibn al-Jawzi, 214 with Ibn Hazm and 213 with Hibat Allah ibn Salama while falling to 134 with al-Nahhas and only 66 with `Abd al-Qahir al-Baghdadi.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Mu`tazili grammarian and author of the Qur&#039;anic commentary Jami` al-Ta&#039;wil li-Muhkam al-Tanzil, Abu Muslim al-Asfahani (254-322), was reputed to have denied intra-Qur&#039;anic naskh altogether. Al-Razi and al-Shawkani refuted him in al-Mahsul and Irshad al-Fusul respectively, but others (such as Ibn Daqiq al-`Id and the contemporary scholar `Ali Hasabullah) justified his stance as a difference in terminology only (khilaf lafzi) - due, for example, to interpreting the word aya as &amp;quot;(super)natural sign&amp;quot; or &amp;quot;previous Scriptures&amp;quot; rather than &amp;quot;Qur&#039;anic verse,&amp;quot; or a reconsideration of purported abrogation to be mere specification (ikhtisas). Hence al-Qarafi&#039;s rebuttal, when al-Razi questioned the claim of consensus on the existence of abrogation: &amp;quot;Agreement has indeed formed over meaning; difference is only over naming.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Misinformation Spread by Apologists==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Only Meccan Verses are Universal Commands===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
When you understand abrogation, you understand what drives Islamic [[terrorism]] and extremism. This has led some apologists to flatly deny they are even aware of such a concept existing within Islam. Some have even attempted to create their own methods in choosing which verses apply to today&#039;s world. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
One such example of this is the reversal of the truth; it is the obscure and baseless claim that the Medinan verses are read only in an historical and non-legal context, while the less violent Meccan verses are universal commands. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This in itself is not a negative thing, but when they try to pass this off to non-Muslims as authentic Islam and claim this is widely accepted by Islamic scholars, while never attempting to rectify the alleged misconceptions with their co-religionists, it is nothing more than [[Islam and Propaganda|deceptive propaganda]]. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Furthermore,  theologically this claim makes zero sense. It contradicts several sahih hadith, and {{cite quran|5|90|end=91|style=ref}} which prohibit the consumption of Alcohol and gambling, are Medinan verses.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Allamah Abu &#039;Abd Allah al-Zanjani - [{{Reference archive|1=http://tanzil.net/pub/ebooks/History-of-Quran.pdf|2=2011-05-13}} The History of the Quran] - Al-Tawheed Vol. 4, No. 3; Vol. 5, No. 1, 2, &amp;amp; 3&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;[{{Reference archive|1=http://www.qran.org/q-chrono.htm|2=2011-05-13}} Quran Verses in Chronological Order] - Qran.org, accessed May 13, 2011&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Kevin P. Edgecomb - [{{Reference archive|1=http://www.bombaxo.com/chronsurs.html|2=2011-05-13}} Chronological Order of Quranic Surahs] - Bombaxo, 2002&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;[{{Reference archive|1=http://www.masjidtucson.org/quran/chapters_chronological_sequence.html|2=2011-05-13}} Quran Chapters and their Chronological Sequence of Revelation] - International Community of Submitters (ICS)&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;[{{Reference archive|1=http://tanzil.net/wiki/Revelation_Order|2=2011-05-13}} Revelation Order] - Tanzil Project, accessed May 13, 2011&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Prior to the revelation of these verses, there were [[Intoxicants and Recreational Games|no prohibitions]] against intoxicants and games of chance. So when is the last time you have heard Muslims claiming drinking alcohol and gambling is permitted in Islam today?&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Abrogation Exists Only Between the Qur&#039;an and Previous Scriptures===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Many modern apologists assert that abrogation does not exist within the Qur&#039;an itself, but that the abrogation mentioned in {{Quran|2|106}} and {{Quran|16|101}} refers to the Qur&#039;an replacing directives given in the [[Taurat]] and [[Injil]]. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Although this understanding has already been shown to be in error by Ibn Kathir&#039;s commentary [[#Meaning of Verse 2:106|here]], let us take a look at these verses in context.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{cite quran|16|101|end=104|style=ref}} |&#039;&#039;&#039;And when We change (one) communication for (another) communication, and Allah knows best what He reveals, they say: You are only a forger. Nay, most of them do not know&#039;&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Say: The Holy spirit has revealed it from your Lord&#039;&#039;&#039; with the truth, that it may establish those who believe and as a guidance and good news for those who submit. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
And certainly We know that they say: &#039;&#039;&#039;Only a mortal teaches him&#039;&#039;&#039;. The tongue of him whom they reproach is barbarous, and this is clear Arabic tongue. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(As for) those who do not believe in Allah&#039;s communications, surely Allah will not guide them, and they shall have a painful punishment.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Islam, the Book of Musa was revealed from Allah to Moses (not via the Qur&#039;an&#039;s “Holy Spirit” which is Jibreel, an Angel). The Gospels which the Qur&#039;an talks about were written by people who were there, or revealed in visions from Allah etc. Again no angels were involved with the revelation of the previous scriptures. So verse 16:101 is clearly talking about Muhammad and the revelation of the Qur&#039;an after talking about abrogation. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{cite quran|2|105|end=108|style=ref}} |Those who disbelieve from among the followers of the Book do not like, nor do the polytheists, that the good should be sent down to you from your Lord, and Allah chooses especially whom He pleases for His mercy, and Allah is the Lord of mighty grace. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Whatever communications We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, We bring one better than it or like it. Do you not know that Allah has power over all things?&#039;&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Do you not know that Allah&#039;s is the kingdom of the heavens and the earth, and that besides Allah you have no guardian or helper? &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Rather you wish to put questions &#039;&#039;to your Messenger&#039;&#039;&#039;&#039;&#039;, as Musa was questioned before; and whoever adopts unbelief instead of faith, he indeed has lost the right direction of the way.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Verse 2:106 in context is clearly talking about those who questioned Muhammad about his contradictions, hence the revelation regarding “abrogation”. This has nothing to do with the “previous scriptures” either. So far its abrogation within the Qur&#039;an itself. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Looking at verse 2:136, Allah says there is no distinction between the previous messages.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|136}}|Say: We believe in Allah and (in) that which had been revealed to us, and (in) that which was revealed to Ibrahim and Ismail and Ishaq and Yaqoub and the tribes, and (in) that which was given to Musa and Isa, and (in) that which was given to the prophets from their Lord, &#039;&#039;&#039;we do not make any distinction between any of them&#039;&#039;&#039;, and to Him do we submit.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Since [[Jesus|Isa]] never wrote a book, we can infer that Allah is talking about the Injil, and Musa; the Taurat. Why would Allah “make no distinction” between them if he had abrogated parts of it? Surely he would have seen fit to mention “except the parts we have substituted”?&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Examples of Abrogation==&lt;br /&gt;
{{main|List of Abrogations in the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Let there be no compulsion in religion===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Verse 2:256&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|256}}|2=Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Meaning of Verse 2:256&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Tafsir Ibn Kathir (unabridged)|Allah says: &amp;quot;There is no compulsion in religion&amp;quot;, meaning: do not force anyone to embrace Islam, because it is clear and its proofs and evidences are manifest. Whoever Allah guides and opens his heart to Islam has indeed embraced it with clear evidence. Whoever Allah misguides blinds his heart and has set a seal on his hearing and a covering on his eyes cannot embrace Islam by force...hence Allah revealed this verse. &#039;&#039;&#039;But, this verse is abrogated by the verse of &amp;quot;fighting...Therefore, all people of the world should be called to Islam. If anyone of them refuses to do so, or refuses to pay the Jizya they should be fought till they are killed. This is the meaning of compulsion.&#039;&#039;&#039; In the Sahih, the Prophet said: &amp;quot;Allah wonders at those people who will enter Paradise in chains&amp;quot;, meaning prisoners brought in chains to the Islamic state, then they embrace Islam sincerely and become righteous, and are entered among the people of Paradise.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;David Bukay - [http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/abrogation-and-the-koran/ Abrogation and the Koran] - School of Political Science, The University of Haifa&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Sam Shamoun and Jochen Katz - [http://www.answering-islam.org/Responses/Menj/taqiyyah.htm Sunni Muslims and Taqiyyah] - Answering Islam&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===If they incline towards peace, you incline also===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Verse 8:60&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|8|61}}|But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in Allah: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Meaning of Verse 8:60&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=1&amp;amp;tTafsirNo=74&amp;amp;tSoraNo=8&amp;amp;tAyahNo=61&amp;amp;tDisplay=yes&amp;amp;Languageid=2 Surat Al-&#039;Anfāl (The Spoils of War) 8:61]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Ibn Abbas in Tafsir Ibn Abbas and Tafsir al-Jalalayn (Suyuti) |2=‘This has been abrogated by the “sword verse” [Q. 9:5]’}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Scholars on 8:60&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Ibn Taymiyyah, ‘Governance According to Allaah’s Law in Reforming the Ruler and his Flock’|&amp;quot;It is the consensus of the scholars of this Ummah that if part of the religion is Allah&#039;s and other part is not, fighting must go on until the entire religion is Allah&#039;s&amp;quot;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Shaykh ul-Islaam Taqi ud-Deen Ahmad ibn Taymiyyah - &#039;[http://www.fisabeelillah.org/books/manhaj/The-Religious-And-Moral-Doctrine-Of-Jihad.pdf The Religious and Moral Doctrine of Jihaad]&#039; - p.28, © Copyright 2001 Maktabah Al Ansaar Publications, ISBN: 0-9539847-5-3&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://www.religioscope.com/info/doc/jihad/azzam_caravan_1_foreword.htm  Join The Caravan, p.9]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Imam Abdullah Azzam|&amp;quot;Jihad and the rifle alone. NO negotiations, NO conferences and NO dialogue.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://www.religioscope.com/info/doc/jihad/azzam_caravan_1_foreword.htm  Join The Caravan, p.20]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Imam Abdullah Azzam|&amp;quot;So, if the fighting stops, the disbelievers will dominate, and fitnah, which is Shirk (polytheism), will spread.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Fight those who fight you, Allah hates aggressors===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Verse 2:190&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|190}}|Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Meaning of verse 2:190&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://quran.com/2/190 Surat Al-Baqarah (The Cow) 2:190]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir al jalayn (Suyuti)|this stipulation was abrogated by the verse of barā’a, ‘immunity’ [Q. 9:1], or by His saying [below]:}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=2&amp;amp;tid=4985 The Command to fight Those Who fight Muslims and killing Them wherever They are found]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir Ibn Kathir|2=(And fight in the way of Allah those who fight you,)&lt;br /&gt;
Abu Al-`Aliyah said, &amp;quot;This was the first Ayah about fighting that was revealed in Al-Madinah. Ever since it was revealed, Allah&#039;s Messenger &#039;&#039;&#039;used to&#039;&#039;&#039; fight only those who fought him and avoid non-combatants. Later, Surat Bara&#039;ah (chapter 9 in the Qur&#039;an) was revealed.&amp;quot; `Abdur-Rahman bin Zayd bin Aslam said similarly, then he said that this was later &#039;&#039;&#039;abrogated by the Ayah&#039;&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Conclusion==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Surah Tawbah is the last Surah of the Qur&#039;an===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Al Taubah&#039;&#039;&#039; (Repentance) is considered to be the [[The Ultimate Message of the Qur&#039;an|closing remarks]] of Allah. It is also the most aggressive chapter of the entire Qur&#039;an.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|11|3941}}|Abu Ishaq said that he heard al-Bara&#039; b &#039;Azib (Allah be pleased with him) say: The last complete sura revealed (in the Holy Qur&#039;an) is Sura tauba (i e. al-Bara&#039;at, ix.), and the last verse revealed is that pertaining to &#039;&#039;&#039;Kalala&#039;&#039;&#039;.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|4|176}}|(*They ask you for a legal verdict. Say: &amp;quot;Allah directs (thus) about Al-Kalalah- )|}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Surah Tawbah cancels all peace treaties===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=9&amp;amp;tid=20750 This is the Ayah of the Sword]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir ibn Kathir|2=&amp;quot;Ibn `Umar said that the Messenger of Allah said,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;I have been commanded to fight the people until they testify that there is no deity worthy of worship except Allah and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, establish the prayer and pay the Zakah.&#039;&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This honorable Ayah (9:5) was called the Ayah of the Sword, about which Ad-Dahhak bin Muzahim said, &#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;quot;It abrogated every agreement of peace between the Prophet and any idolator, every treaty, and every term.&#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; Al-`Awfi said that Ibn `Abbas commented: &amp;quot;No idolator had any more treaty or promise of safety ever since Surah Bara&#039;ah was revealed. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Core Scripture}}&lt;br /&gt;
==See Also==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Hub4|Abrogation|Abrogation}}&lt;br /&gt;
*[[Qur&#039;an, Hadith and Scholars:Islamic Theology]]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==External Links==&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.meforum.org/1754/peace-or-jihad-abrogation-in-islam Peace or Jihad? Abrogation in Islam]&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/abrogation-and-the-koran/ Abrogation and the Koran]&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.fatherzakaria.net/books/qaf/pdf/22-Episode.pdf Examples of the Abrogation]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==References==&lt;br /&gt;
{{reflist}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Qur&#039;an]]&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Jihad and Terrorism]]&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Naskh_(Abrogation)&amp;diff=107454</id>
		<title>Naskh (Abrogation)</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Naskh_(Abrogation)&amp;diff=107454"/>
		<updated>2014-05-15T12:14:18Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Verse 2:106 */ Arabic correction&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&#039;&#039;&#039;Abrogation&#039;&#039;&#039; ([[Abrogation|Naskh]]) refers to one [[Qur&#039;an|Qur&#039;anic]] verse superseding another, and is itself supported by Qur&#039;anic verses and various [[hadith]] narrations. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Introduction==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Understanding the necessity for Naskh is crucial in understanding [[Islam]] and its theology. The Qur&#039;an is said to have been revealed by the angel [[Gabriel|Jibreel]] to Prophet [[Muhammad]] over a period of twenty-three years.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&#039;&#039;Living Religions: An Encyclopaedia of the World&#039;s Faiths,&#039;&#039; Mary Pat Fisher, 1997, page 338,  I.B. Tauris Publishers, &amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;{{Quran|17|106}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; During those years, a lot had changed in his personal and private life. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Muhammad began as a preacher, and ended his life as the founder and Head of the first Islamic state, so it is not surprising that the style and message of [[:Category:Medinan Surah|later Medinan]] Qur&#039;anic revelations changed and often conflicted with [[:Category:Meccan Surah|earlier Meccan]] ones. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Today&#039;s Qur&#039;an, when read at face value with its non-chronological organization, can support any number of views on several subjects, and when read as a whole, many [[surah]]s clearly contradict one another. This is why Muhammad himself (through Qur&#039;anic [[revelations]]) introduced this concept into Islam. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
At the time of the [[Caliph|caliphate]], some scholars (particularly a preacher from Kufa, [[Iraq]]) were banned from explaining and preaching the Qur&#039;an by early &#039;ilmic authority figure (usually &#039;Alī but sometimes also Ibn &#039;Abbās) because of their ignorance of the principles of naskh.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Powers, &#039;&#039;The Exegetical Genre nāsikh al-Qur&#039;ān wa mansūkhuhu&#039;&#039;, ISBN 0-19-826546-8, p. 124&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Andrew Rippin, &#039;&#039;Bulletin of the School of Oriental and African Studies&#039;&#039; 47,  ISSN 0041-977X, pp. 26, 38&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some may claim this doctrine does not exist or is not a part of mainstream Islam. However, when you view the [[Chronological Order of the Qur&#039;an|chronological order]] of the revelations, it becomes undeniable. Moreover, Muslims adhere to this doctrine everyday by prohibiting the consumption of [[alcohol]].&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verse 2:106===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://islamawakened.org/quran/2/106/default.htm Qur&#039;an Text/Transliteration 2:106] |2=&#039;&#039;&#039;Arabic:&#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;lt;font size=&amp;quot;4&amp;quot;&amp;gt;ماننسخ من آية أو ننسها نأت بخير منها أو مثلها ألم تعلم أن الله على كل شيئ قدير &amp;lt;/font&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Transliteration:&#039;&#039;&#039; &#039;&#039;Ma nansakh min ayatin aw nunsiha na/ti bikhayrin minha aw mithliha alam taaalam anna Allaha aala kulli shay-in qadeerun&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Shakir:&#039;&#039;&#039; Whatever communications We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, We bring one better than it or like it. Do you not know that Allah has power over all things?}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Meaning of Verse 2:106====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=2&amp;amp;tid=2938 The Meaning of Naskh]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir ibn Kathir|2=&#039;&#039;&#039;The Meaning of Naskh&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn Abi Talhah said that Ibn `Abbas said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;Whatever an Ayah We abrogate.&#039;&#039; Also, Ibn Jurayj said that Mujahid said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;Whatever an Ayah We erase.&#039;&#039; Also, Ibn Abi Najih said that Mujahid said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;We keep the words, but change the meaning.&#039;&#039; He related these words to the companions of `Abdullah bin Mas`ud. Ibn Abi Hatim said that similar statements were mentioned by Abu Al-`Aliyah and Muhammad bin Ka`b Al-Qurazi. Also As-Suddi said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;We erase it.&#039;&#039; Further, Ibn Abi Hatim said that it means, &amp;quot;Erase and raise it, such as erasing the following wordings (from the Qur&#039;an), `The married adulterer and the married adulteress: stone them to death,&#039; and, `If the son of Adam had two valleys of gold, he would seek a third.&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn Jarir stated that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;Whatever ruling we repeal in an Ayah by making the allowed unlawful and the unlawful allowed.&#039;&#039; The Nasakh only occurs with commandments, prohibitions, permissions, and so forth. As for stories, they do not undergo Nasakh. The word, `Nasakh&#039; literally means, `to copy a book&#039;. The meaning of Nasakh in the case of commandments is removing the commandment and replacing it by another. And whether the Nasakh involves the wordings, the ruling or both, it is still called Nasakh.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Allah said next,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(or Nunsiha (cause it to be forgotten)). `Ali bin Abi Talhah said that Ibn `Abbas said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh or Nunsiha) means, &amp;quot;Whatever Ayah We repeal or uphold without change.&#039;&#039; Also, Mujahid said that the companions of Ibn Mas`ud (who read this word Nansa&#039;ha) said that it means, &amp;quot;We uphold its wording and change its ruling.&#039;&#039; Further, `Ubayd bin `Umayr, Mujahid and `Ata&#039; said, `Nansa&#039;ha&#039; means, &amp;quot;We delay it (i.e., do not abrogate it).&#039;&#039; Further, `Atiyyah Al-`Awfi said that the Ayah means, &amp;quot;We delay repealing it.&#039;&#039; This is the same Tafsir provided by As-Suddi and Ar-Rabi` bin Anas. `Abdur-Razzaq said that Ma`mar said that Qatadah said about Allah&#039;s statement,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten) &amp;quot;Allah made His Prophet forget what He willed and He abrogated what He will.&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Allah&#039;s said,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one or similar to it), better, relates to the benefit provided for the one it addresses, as reported from `Ali bin Abi Talhah that Ibn `Abbas said,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one) means, &amp;quot;We bring forth a more beneficial ruling, that is also easier for you.&#039;&#039; Also, As-Suddi said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one or similar to it) means, &amp;quot;We bring forth a better Ayah, or similar to that which was repealed.&#039;&#039; Qatadah also said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one or similar to it) means, &amp;quot;We replace it by an Ayah more facilitating, permitting, commanding, or prohibiting.&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verse 13:39===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|13|39}}|Allah doth blot out or confirm what He pleaseth: with Him is the Mother of the Book.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verse 16:101===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|101}}|And when We change (one) communication for (another) communication, and Allah knows best what He reveals, they say: You are only a forger. Nay, most of them do not know.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verses 17:85-86===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|17|85|86}}|They ask thee concerning the Spirit (of inspiration). Say: &amp;quot;The Spirit (cometh) by command of my Lord: of knowledge it is only a little that is communicated to you, (O men!)&amp;quot; If it were Our Will, We could take away that which We have sent thee by inspiration:then wouldst thou find none to plead thy affair in that matter as against Us,-}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verses 87:6-7===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|87|6|7}}|By degrees shall We teach thee to declare (the Message), so thou shalt not forget, Except as Allah wills: For He knoweth what is manifest and what is hidden.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Hadith==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sahih Bukhari===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The following [[sahih]] narration indicates their are many verses in the Qur&#039;an that have been abrogated, but all of them had to be included.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|53}}|I said to &#039;Uthman bin &#039;Affan (while he was collecting the Qur&#039;an) regarding the Verse:-- &amp;quot;Those of you who die and leave wives ...&amp;quot; (2.240) &amp;quot;&#039;&#039;&#039;This Verse was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by an other Verse. So why should you write it? (Or leave it in the Qur&#039;an)?&amp;quot; &#039;Uthman said. &amp;quot;O son of my brother! I will not shift anything of it from its place.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|33}}|They had a choice, either fast or feed a poor for every day..&amp;quot; and added, &amp;quot;This Verse is &#039;&#039;&#039;abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039;.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|32}}|That he heard Ibn &#039;Abbas reciting the Divine Verse:--&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;And for those who can fast they had a choice either fast, or feed a poor for every day..&amp;quot; (2.184) Ibn &#039;Abbas said, &amp;quot;This Verse is not abrogated, but it is meant for old men and old women who have no strength to fast, so they should feed one poor person for each day of fasting (instead of fasting).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|34}}|&amp;quot;For those who can fast, they had a choice either fast, or feed a poor for every day,&amp;quot; (2.184) was revealed, it was permissible for one to give a ransom and give up fasting, till the Verse succeeding it was revealed and abrogated it.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|54}}|&#039;Ata said: Ibn &#039;Abbas said, &amp;quot;This Verse, i.e. the Statement of Allah: &amp;quot;..without turning them out..&amp;quot; &#039;&#039;&#039;cancelled the obligation&#039;&#039;&#039; of staying for the waiting period in her dead husband&#039;s house, and she can complete this period wherever she likes}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|68}}|This Verse:--&amp;quot;Whether you show what is in your minds or conceal it..&amp;quot; (2.284) &#039;&#039;&#039;was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|69}}|A man from the companions of Allah&#039;s Apostle who I think, was Ibn &#039;Umar said, &amp;quot;The Verse:-- ‘Whether you show what is in your minds or conceal it ...’ &#039;&#039;&#039;was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by the Verse following it.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sahih Muslim===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|003|0675}}|The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) abrogated some of his commands by others, &#039;&#039;&#039;just as the Qur&#039;an abrogates&#039;&#039;&#039; some part with the other.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|4|1317}}|Al-Bara&#039; b. &#039;Azib reported: This verse was revealed (in this way): &amp;quot;Guard the prayers and the &#039;Asr prayer.&amp;quot; We recited it (in this very way) so long as Allah desired. Allah, then, abrogated it and it was revealed: &amp;quot;Guard the prayers, and the middle prayer.&amp;quot; A person who was sitting with Shaqiq (one of the narrators in the chain of transmitters) said: Now it implies the &#039;Asr prayer. Upon this al-Bara&#039; said: I have already informed you how this (verse) was revealed and how &#039;&#039;&#039;Allah abrogated it&#039;&#039;&#039;, and Allah knows best. Imam Muslim said: Ashja&#039;i narrated it from Sufyan al-Thauri, who narrated it from al-Aswad b. Qais, who narrated it from &#039;Uqba, who narrated it from al-Bara&#039; b. &#039;Azib who said: We recited with the Prophet (may peace be upon him) (the above-mentioned verse like this, i. e. instead of Salat al- Wusta, Salat al-&#039;Asr) for a certain period, as it has been mentioned (in the above-quoted hadith).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|4|1433}}|Anas b. Malik reported that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) invoked curse in the morning (prayer) for thirty days upon those who killed the Companions (of the Holy Prophet) at Bi&#039;r Ma&#039;una. He cursed (the tribes) of Ri&#039;l, Dhakwan, Lihyan, and Usayya, who had disobeyed Allah and His Messenger (may peace be upon him). Anas said: Allah the Exalted and Great revealed (a verse) regarding those who were killed at Bi&#039;r Ma&#039;una, and we recited it, till it was abrogated later on (and the verse was like this):, convey to it our people the tidings that we have met our Lord, and He was pleased with us and we were pleased with Him&amp;quot;.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|43|7173}}|Sa&#039;id b. Jubair reported: I said to Ibn Abbas: Will the repentance of that person be accepted who kills a believer intentionally? He said: No. I recited to him this verse of Sura al-Furqan (xix.): &amp;quot;And those who call not upon another god with Allah and slay not the soul which Allah has forbidden except in the cause of justice&amp;quot; to the end of the verse. He said: This is a Meccan verse which has been abrogated by a verse revealed at Medina: &amp;quot;He who slays a believer intentionally, for him is the requital of Hell-Fire where he would abide for ever,&amp;quot; and in the narration of Ibn Hisham (the words are): I recited to him this verse of Sura al-Furqan: &amp;quot;Except one who made repentance.&amp;quot; (see also Sahih al-Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 285)}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Abu Dawud===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Abudawud|5|1299}}|In Surat al-Muzzammil (73), the verse: &amp;quot;Keep vigil at night but a little, a half thereof&amp;quot; (2-3) &#039;&#039;&#039;has been abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by the following verse: &amp;quot;He knoweth that ye count it not, and turneth unto you in mercy. Recite then of the Qur&#039;an that which is easy for you&amp;quot; (v.20). The phrase &amp;quot;the vigil of the night&amp;quot; (nashi&#039;at al-layl) means the early hours of the night. They (the companions) would pray (the tahajjud prayer) in the early hours of the night.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Abudawud|1|1300}}|Ibn ‘Abbas said: When the opening verses of Surah asl-muzzammil (lxxiii.), were revealed, the Companions would pray as long as they would pray during Ramadan &#039;&#039;&#039;until its last verses were revealed&#039;&#039;&#039;.}} &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Abudawud|12|2275}}|Women who are divorced shall wait, keeping themselves apart, three monthly courses; and then said: And for such of your women as despair of menstruation, if ye doubt, their period (of waiting) shall be three months. &#039;&#039;&#039;This was abrogated from the former verse&#039;&#039;&#039;. Again he said: (O ye who believe, if ye wed believing women) and divorce them before ye have touched them, then there is no period that ye should reckon.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Al Muwatta===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Neither the abrogating nor the abrogated verses on suckling appear in the text of the Qur&#039;an today. This, along with the Qur&#039;anic [[Stoning|verse of rajm]] (stoning), were written on a piece of paper and were reportedly lost when a goat [[Qur&#039;an, Hadith and Scholars:Stoning|ate them]].&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Musnad Ahmad bin Hanbal. vol. 6. page 269; Sunan Ibn Majah, page 626; Ibn Qutbah, Tawil Mukhtalafi &#039;l-Hadith (Cairo: Maktaba al-Kulliyat al-Azhariyya. 1966) page 310; As-Suyuti, ad-Durru &#039;l-Manthur, vol. 2. page 13&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muwatta|30|3|17}}|Yahya related to me from Malik from Abdullah ibn Abi Bakr ibn Hazm from Amra bint Abd ar-Rahman that A&#039;isha, the wife of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, said, &amp;quot;Amongst what was sent down of the Qur&#039;an was &#039;ten known sucklings make haram&#039; - &#039;&#039;&#039;then it was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by &#039;five known sucklings&#039;. When the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, died, it was what is now recited of the Qur&#039;an.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Yahya said that Malik said, &amp;quot;One does not act on this.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muwatta|37|5|4b}}|&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Yahya said that he heard Malik say, &amp;quot;This ayat is abrogated. It is the word of Allah, the Blessed, the Exalted, &#039;If he leaves goods, the testament is for parents and kinsmen.&#039; What came down about the division of the fixed shares of inheritance in the Book of Allah, the Mighty, the Exalted, &#039;&#039;&#039;abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; it&amp;quot; ...}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Ibn Majah===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Ibn Majah Vol. 3, Book 9, Hadith 1942|It was narrated that &#039;Aishah said:&lt;br /&gt;
 &lt;br /&gt;
“Once of the things that &#039;&#039;&#039;Allah revealed in the the Qur&#039;an and then abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; was that nothing makes marriage prohibited except ten breastfeedings or five well-known (breastfeedings).” (Sahih)}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Scholars==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Companions of Muhammad===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Ali, the fourth Rightly-guided Caliph, knowing the difference between abrogating and abrogated verses will save you from being damned.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote||Ali [&#039;Ali ibn Abi Talib]said to Abdul Rahman “can you differentiate between abrogating and abrogated verses” Abdul Rahman said, “no.” Thereupon Ali said “Thou art damned and causeth others to be damned.”&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&#039;&#039;Annasikh-wal-Mansukh&#039;&#039;, by Abul Qasim, published by Hindia Press, Cairo, p. 6. A similar saying is found in &#039;&#039;An-Nasikh -wal- Mansukh &#039;&#039;(i.e. Abrogating &amp;amp; Abrogated), by Abu Ja&#039;afar An-Nah&#039;has, Beirut, 2003, p. 9, and &#039;&#039;Nawasikh Al-Qur&#039;an&#039;&#039; (i.e. The Abrogating of the Qur&#039;an), by Ibn Al-Jauzy, Beirut 2002, p. 24, and &#039;&#039;Al-Itqan Fi Ulum Al Qur&#039;an&#039;&#039; by Al-Suyuti, II, p. 700.&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote||&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;Although the companions of Muhammad are reported to have discussed naskh, and even to have disagreed over the abrogation of a particular verse, references to the generation of the companions in the naskh literature are relatively infrequent.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Ibn Salama, al-Nasikh wa ‘l-mansukh (Cairo 1315/1899), 142-3, where `Ali and Ibn ‘Abbas disagree over the abrogation of Quran 4:94; `Ali maintained that the verse was abrogated by Quran 4:115 and 4:48, while Ibn ‘Abbas held that it remained muhkama.&#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;A.Rippin&amp;quot;&amp;gt;(referenced by A.Rippin) [http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/abrogation-and-the-koran/ Abrogation and the Koran] - David Bukay, School of Political Science, The University of Haifa&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Early Scholars===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote||&amp;quot;The number of verses that are considered to have been abrogated increased dramatically between the eighth and eleventh centuries (al-Zuhri mentions 42 abrogated verses, al-Nahhas 138, and Ibn Salama, 238), at which point an upper limit seems to have been reached (Ibn ‘Ata’iqi identifies 231 abrogated verses, and al-Farsi, 248). &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
- &amp;quot;al-Suyuti (d. 911/1505) recognised only twenty [20] instances of true abrogation and Shah Wali Allah (d 1762) reduced that number to five [5].&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;these figures are mentioned in Ernest Hahn, ‘Sir Sayyid Ahmad Khan’s The Controversy over Abrogation (in the Qur’an)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn al-’Ata’iqi, on the other hand, while citing 231 instances of abrogation, appendixes the phrase wa fihi nazar, indicating doubt or uncertainty to his discussion of twenty-six verses.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
.....&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
- &amp;quot;There is also considerable disagreement over the scope of abrogation within the Qur’an itself. At one extreme, there were apparently certain people who argued that ‘the Qur’an does not contain either an abrogated or an abrogating verse’.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(&amp;quot;Ibn Salama, p. 26; cf. Al-Nahhas, pp 2-3&amp;quot;), these people, according to Ibn Salama, ‘&#039;&#039;&#039;have deviated from the truth&#039;&#039;&#039; and by virtue of their lying, have turned away from God’. (&amp;quot;Ibn Salama, p. 26)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
At the other extreme were those scholars who maintained that any narrative, positive command, or prohibition in the Qur’an may be abrogated.&amp;quot; (&amp;quot;Al-Nahhas, pp. 2-3&amp;quot;)&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;A.Rippin&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Ibn Salma , those who reject abrogation have deviated from the truth. Once again, its improtant to note at the time of the caliphate, some scholars (particularly a preacher from Kufa, Iraq) were banned from explaining and preaching the Qur&#039;ān by early &#039;ilmic authority figures because of their ignorance of the principles of naskh.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Modern Scholars===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://mac.abc.se/home/onesr/ez/in/it1/Abrogation_Hadith.txt Abrogation and Hadith]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Shaykh Gibril Fouad Haddad, living islam, December 23, 2008|Naskh is a fact since Allah Most High said &amp;quot;We do not erase (nansakh) any aya or cause it to be forgotten (nunsiha) but bring a better one or the like of it&amp;quot; (2:106).&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Second, the mutual abrogability of the Qur&#039;an and the Sunna (i) is rationally possible - since the Qur&#039;an describes the Sunna as revealed as well: &amp;quot;Nor does he speak of his own desire&amp;quot; (53:3) - and &lt;br /&gt;
(ii) occurs in the Law, as per the abrogation of the verse of bequest (2:180) by the mass-transmitted hadith &amp;quot;There is no bequest for anyone who stands to inherit.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Imam al-Shafi`i famously dissented with the massive majority of the Scholars when he said that only the Qur&#039;an abrogates the Qur&#039;an and only the Sunna abrogates the Sunna, but his School did not follow him in this cf. Imam al-Haramayn in Mughith al-Khalq and the contemporary Shaykh Hasan Hitu in al-Wajiz fi Usul al-Tashri` al-Islami, both staunch Shafi`is.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
We should be aware that in recent times the tendency has been toward minimalism, much of it a reaction to Orientalist and other attempts to construe naskh as a literary rewrite invalidating Divine origin, some Muslim revisionists even forwarding the view that there is no &lt;br /&gt;
abrogation in the Qur&#039;an. However, of the 60-odd teatises written on abrogation there is no precedent for such an extreme view. The number of cases hovers around 200, peaking at 247 with Ibn al-Jawzi, 214 with Ibn Hazm and 213 with Hibat Allah ibn Salama while falling to 134 with al-Nahhas and only 66 with `Abd al-Qahir al-Baghdadi.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Mu`tazili grammarian and author of the Qur&#039;anic commentary Jami` al-Ta&#039;wil li-Muhkam al-Tanzil, Abu Muslim al-Asfahani (254-322), was reputed to have denied intra-Qur&#039;anic naskh altogether. Al-Razi and al-Shawkani refuted him in al-Mahsul and Irshad al-Fusul respectively, but others (such as Ibn Daqiq al-`Id and the contemporary scholar `Ali Hasabullah) justified his stance as a difference in terminology only (khilaf lafzi) - due, for example, to interpreting the word aya as &amp;quot;(super)natural sign&amp;quot; or &amp;quot;previous Scriptures&amp;quot; rather than &amp;quot;Qur&#039;anic verse,&amp;quot; or a reconsideration of purported abrogation to be mere specification (ikhtisas). Hence al-Qarafi&#039;s rebuttal, when al-Razi questioned the claim of consensus on the existence of abrogation: &amp;quot;Agreement has indeed formed over meaning; difference is only over naming.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Misinformation Spread by Apologists==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Only Meccan Verses are Universal Commands===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
When you understand abrogation, you understand what drives Islamic [[terrorism]] and extremism. This has led some apologists to flatly deny they are even aware of such a concept existing within Islam. Some have even attempted to create their own methods in choosing which verses apply to today&#039;s world. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
One such example of this is the reversal of the truth; it is the obscure and baseless claim that the Medinan verses are read only in an historical and non-legal context, while the less violent Meccan verses are universal commands. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This in itself is not a negative thing, but when they try to pass this off to non-Muslims as authentic Islam and claim this is widely accepted by Islamic scholars, while never attempting to rectify the alleged misconceptions with their co-religionists, it is nothing more than [[Islam and Propaganda|deceptive propaganda]]. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Furthermore,  theologically this claim makes zero sense. It contradicts several sahih hadith, and {{cite quran|5|90|end=91|style=ref}} which prohibit the consumption of Alcohol and gambling, are Medinan verses.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Allamah Abu &#039;Abd Allah al-Zanjani - [{{Reference archive|1=http://tanzil.net/pub/ebooks/History-of-Quran.pdf|2=2011-05-13}} The History of the Quran] - Al-Tawheed Vol. 4, No. 3; Vol. 5, No. 1, 2, &amp;amp; 3&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;[{{Reference archive|1=http://www.qran.org/q-chrono.htm|2=2011-05-13}} Quran Verses in Chronological Order] - Qran.org, accessed May 13, 2011&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Kevin P. Edgecomb - [{{Reference archive|1=http://www.bombaxo.com/chronsurs.html|2=2011-05-13}} Chronological Order of Quranic Surahs] - Bombaxo, 2002&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;[{{Reference archive|1=http://www.masjidtucson.org/quran/chapters_chronological_sequence.html|2=2011-05-13}} Quran Chapters and their Chronological Sequence of Revelation] - International Community of Submitters (ICS)&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;[{{Reference archive|1=http://tanzil.net/wiki/Revelation_Order|2=2011-05-13}} Revelation Order] - Tanzil Project, accessed May 13, 2011&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Prior to the revelation of these verses, there were [[Intoxicants and Recreational Games|no prohibitions]] against intoxicants and games of chance. So when is the last time you have heard Muslims claiming drinking alcohol and gambling is permitted in Islam today?&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Abrogation Exists Only Between the Qur&#039;an and Previous Scriptures===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Many modern apologists assert that abrogation does not exist within the Qur&#039;an itself, but that the abrogation mentioned in {{Quran|2|106}} and {{Quran|16|101}} refers to the Qur&#039;an replacing directives given in the [[Taurat]] and [[Injil]]. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Although this understanding has already been shown to be in error by Ibn Kathir&#039;s commentary [[#Meaning of Verse 2:106|here]], let us take a look at these verses in context.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{cite quran|16|101|end=104|style=ref}} |&#039;&#039;&#039;And when We change (one) communication for (another) communication, and Allah knows best what He reveals, they say: You are only a forger. Nay, most of them do not know&#039;&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Say: The Holy spirit has revealed it from your Lord&#039;&#039;&#039; with the truth, that it may establish those who believe and as a guidance and good news for those who submit. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
And certainly We know that they say: &#039;&#039;&#039;Only a mortal teaches him&#039;&#039;&#039;. The tongue of him whom they reproach is barbarous, and this is clear Arabic tongue. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(As for) those who do not believe in Allah&#039;s communications, surely Allah will not guide them, and they shall have a painful punishment.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Islam, the Book of Musa was revealed from Allah to Moses (not via the Qur&#039;an&#039;s “Holy Spirit” which is Jibreel, an Angel). The Gospels which the Qur&#039;an talks about were written by people who were there, or revealed in visions from Allah etc. Again no angels were involved with the revelation of the previous scriptures. So verse 16:101 is clearly talking about Muhammad and the revelation of the Qur&#039;an after talking about abrogation. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{cite quran|2|105|end=108|style=ref}} |Those who disbelieve from among the followers of the Book do not like, nor do the polytheists, that the good should be sent down to you from your Lord, and Allah chooses especially whom He pleases for His mercy, and Allah is the Lord of mighty grace. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Whatever communications We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, We bring one better than it or like it. Do you not know that Allah has power over all things?&#039;&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Do you not know that Allah&#039;s is the kingdom of the heavens and the earth, and that besides Allah you have no guardian or helper? &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Rather you wish to put questions &#039;&#039;to your Messenger&#039;&#039;&#039;&#039;&#039;, as Musa was questioned before; and whoever adopts unbelief instead of faith, he indeed has lost the right direction of the way.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Verse 2:106 in context is clearly talking about those who questioned Muhammad about his contradictions, hence the revelation regarding “abrogation”. This has nothing to do with the “previous scriptures” either. So far its abrogation within the Qur&#039;an itself. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Looking at verse 2:136, Allah says there is no distinction between the previous messages.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|136}}|Say: We believe in Allah and (in) that which had been revealed to us, and (in) that which was revealed to Ibrahim and Ismail and Ishaq and Yaqoub and the tribes, and (in) that which was given to Musa and Isa, and (in) that which was given to the prophets from their Lord, &#039;&#039;&#039;we do not make any distinction between any of them&#039;&#039;&#039;, and to Him do we submit.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Since [[Jesus|Isa]] never wrote a book, we can infer that Allah is talking about the Injil, and Musa; the Taurat. Why would Allah “make no distinction” between them if he had abrogated parts of it? Surely he would have seen fit to mention “except the parts we have substituted”?&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Examples of Abrogation==&lt;br /&gt;
{{main|List of Abrogations in the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Let there be no compulsion in religion===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Verse 2:256&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|256}}|2=Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Meaning of Verse 2:256&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Tafsir Ibn Kathir (unabridged)|Allah says: &amp;quot;There is no compulsion in religion&amp;quot;, meaning: do not force anyone to embrace Islam, because it is clear and its proofs and evidences are manifest. Whoever Allah guides and opens his heart to Islam has indeed embraced it with clear evidence. Whoever Allah misguides blinds his heart and has set a seal on his hearing and a covering on his eyes cannot embrace Islam by force...hence Allah revealed this verse. &#039;&#039;&#039;But, this verse is abrogated by the verse of &amp;quot;fighting...Therefore, all people of the world should be called to Islam. If anyone of them refuses to do so, or refuses to pay the Jizya they should be fought till they are killed. This is the meaning of compulsion.&#039;&#039;&#039; In the Sahih, the Prophet said: &amp;quot;Allah wonders at those people who will enter Paradise in chains&amp;quot;, meaning prisoners brought in chains to the Islamic state, then they embrace Islam sincerely and become righteous, and are entered among the people of Paradise.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;David Bukay - [http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/abrogation-and-the-koran/ Abrogation and the Koran] - School of Political Science, The University of Haifa&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Sam Shamoun and Jochen Katz - [http://www.answering-islam.org/Responses/Menj/taqiyyah.htm Sunni Muslims and Taqiyyah] - Answering Islam&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===If they incline towards peace, you incline also===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Verse 8:60&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|8|61}}|But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in Allah: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Meaning of Verse 8:60&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=1&amp;amp;tTafsirNo=74&amp;amp;tSoraNo=8&amp;amp;tAyahNo=61&amp;amp;tDisplay=yes&amp;amp;Languageid=2 Surat Al-&#039;Anfāl (The Spoils of War) 8:61]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Ibn Abbas in Tafsir Ibn Abbas and Tafsir al-Jalalayn (Suyuti) |2=‘This has been abrogated by the “sword verse” [Q. 9:5]’}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Scholars on 8:60&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Ibn Taymiyyah, ‘Governance According to Allaah’s Law in Reforming the Ruler and his Flock’|&amp;quot;It is the consensus of the scholars of this Ummah that if part of the religion is Allah&#039;s and other part is not, fighting must go on until the entire religion is Allah&#039;s&amp;quot;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Shaykh ul-Islaam Taqi ud-Deen Ahmad ibn Taymiyyah - &#039;[http://www.fisabeelillah.org/books/manhaj/The-Religious-And-Moral-Doctrine-Of-Jihad.pdf The Religious and Moral Doctrine of Jihaad]&#039; - p.28, © Copyright 2001 Maktabah Al Ansaar Publications, ISBN: 0-9539847-5-3&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://www.religioscope.com/info/doc/jihad/azzam_caravan_1_foreword.htm  Join The Caravan, p.9]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Imam Abdullah Azzam|&amp;quot;Jihad and the rifle alone. NO negotiations, NO conferences and NO dialogue.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://www.religioscope.com/info/doc/jihad/azzam_caravan_1_foreword.htm  Join The Caravan, p.20]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Imam Abdullah Azzam|&amp;quot;So, if the fighting stops, the disbelievers will dominate, and fitnah, which is Shirk (polytheism), will spread.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Fight those who fight you, Allah hates aggressors===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Verse 2:190&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|190}}|Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Meaning of verse 2:190&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://quran.com/2/190 Surat Al-Baqarah (The Cow) 2:190]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir al jalayn (Suyuti)|this stipulation was abrogated by the verse of barā’a, ‘immunity’ [Q. 9:1], or by His saying [below]:}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=2&amp;amp;tid=4985 The Command to fight Those Who fight Muslims and killing Them wherever They are found]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir Ibn Kathir|2=(And fight in the way of Allah those who fight you,)&lt;br /&gt;
Abu Al-`Aliyah said, &amp;quot;This was the first Ayah about fighting that was revealed in Al-Madinah. Ever since it was revealed, Allah&#039;s Messenger &#039;&#039;&#039;used to&#039;&#039;&#039; fight only those who fought him and avoid non-combatants. Later, Surat Bara&#039;ah (chapter 9 in the Qur&#039;an) was revealed.&amp;quot; `Abdur-Rahman bin Zayd bin Aslam said similarly, then he said that this was later &#039;&#039;&#039;abrogated by the Ayah&#039;&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Conclusion==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Surah Tawbah is the last Surah of the Qur&#039;an===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Al Taubah&#039;&#039;&#039; (Repentance) is considered to be the [[The Ultimate Message of the Qur&#039;an|closing remarks]] of Allah. It is also the most aggressive chapter of the entire Qur&#039;an.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|11|3941}}|Abu Ishaq said that he heard al-Bara&#039; b &#039;Azib (Allah be pleased with him) say: The last complete sura revealed (in the Holy Qur&#039;an) is Sura tauba (i e. al-Bara&#039;at, ix.), and the last verse revealed is that pertaining to &#039;&#039;&#039;Kalala&#039;&#039;&#039;.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|4|176}}|(*They ask you for a legal verdict. Say: &amp;quot;Allah directs (thus) about Al-Kalalah- )|}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Surah Tawbah cancels all peace treaties===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=9&amp;amp;tid=20750 This is the Ayah of the Sword]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir ibn Kathir|2=&amp;quot;Ibn `Umar said that the Messenger of Allah said,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;I have been commanded to fight the people until they testify that there is no deity worthy of worship except Allah and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, establish the prayer and pay the Zakah.&#039;&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This honorable Ayah (9:5) was called the Ayah of the Sword, about which Ad-Dahhak bin Muzahim said, &#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;quot;It abrogated every agreement of peace between the Prophet and any idolator, every treaty, and every term.&#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; Al-`Awfi said that Ibn `Abbas commented: &amp;quot;No idolator had any more treaty or promise of safety ever since Surah Bara&#039;ah was revealed. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Core Scripture}}&lt;br /&gt;
==See Also==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Hub4|Abrogation|Abrogation}}&lt;br /&gt;
*[[Qur&#039;an, Hadith and Scholars:Islamic Theology]]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==External Links==&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.meforum.org/1754/peace-or-jihad-abrogation-in-islam Peace or Jihad? Abrogation in Islam]&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/abrogation-and-the-koran/ Abrogation and the Koran]&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.fatherzakaria.net/books/qaf/pdf/22-Episode.pdf Examples of the Abrogation]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==References==&lt;br /&gt;
{{reflist}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Qur&#039;an]]&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Jihad and Terrorism]]&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Naskh_(Abrogation)&amp;diff=107453</id>
		<title>Naskh (Abrogation)</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Naskh_(Abrogation)&amp;diff=107453"/>
		<updated>2014-05-15T12:13:04Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Verse 2:106 */  I only corrected the Arabic verse.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&#039;&#039;&#039;Abrogation&#039;&#039;&#039; ([[Abrogation|Naskh]]) refers to one [[Qur&#039;an|Qur&#039;anic]] verse superseding another, and is itself supported by Qur&#039;anic verses and various [[hadith]] narrations. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Introduction==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Understanding the necessity for Naskh is crucial in understanding [[Islam]] and its theology. The Qur&#039;an is said to have been revealed by the angel [[Gabriel|Jibreel]] to Prophet [[Muhammad]] over a period of twenty-three years.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&#039;&#039;Living Religions: An Encyclopaedia of the World&#039;s Faiths,&#039;&#039; Mary Pat Fisher, 1997, page 338,  I.B. Tauris Publishers, &amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;{{Quran|17|106}&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; During those years, a lot had changed in his personal and private life. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Muhammad began as a preacher, and ended his life as the founder and Head of the first Islamic state, so it is not surprising that the style and message of [[:Category:Medinan Surah|later Medinan]] Qur&#039;anic revelations changed and often conflicted with [[:Category:Meccan Surah|earlier Meccan]] ones. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Today&#039;s Qur&#039;an, when read at face value with its non-chronological organization, can support any number of views on several subjects, and when read as a whole, many [[surah]]s clearly contradict one another. This is why Muhammad himself (through Qur&#039;anic [[revelations]]) introduced this concept into Islam. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
At the time of the [[Caliph|caliphate]], some scholars (particularly a preacher from Kufa, [[Iraq]]) were banned from explaining and preaching the Qur&#039;an by early &#039;ilmic authority figure (usually &#039;Alī but sometimes also Ibn &#039;Abbās) because of their ignorance of the principles of naskh.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Powers, &#039;&#039;The Exegetical Genre nāsikh al-Qur&#039;ān wa mansūkhuhu&#039;&#039;, ISBN 0-19-826546-8, p. 124&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Andrew Rippin, &#039;&#039;Bulletin of the School of Oriental and African Studies&#039;&#039; 47,  ISSN 0041-977X, pp. 26, 38&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some may claim this doctrine does not exist or is not a part of mainstream Islam. However, when you view the [[Chronological Order of the Qur&#039;an|chronological order]] of the revelations, it becomes undeniable. Moreover, Muslims adhere to this doctrine everyday by prohibiting the consumption of [[alcohol]].&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Qur&#039;an==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verse 2:106===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://islamawakened.org/quran/2/106/default.htm Qur&#039;an Text/Transliteration 2:106] |2=&#039;&#039;&#039;Arabic:&#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;lt;font size=&amp;quot;4&amp;quot;&amp;gt;ماننسخ من آية أو ننسها نأت بخير منها أو مثلها ألم تعلم أن الله على كل شئ قدير &amp;lt;/font&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Transliteration:&#039;&#039;&#039; &#039;&#039;Ma nansakh min ayatin aw nunsiha na/ti bikhayrin minha aw mithliha alam taaalam anna Allaha aala kulli shay-in qadeerun&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Shakir:&#039;&#039;&#039; Whatever communications We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, We bring one better than it or like it. Do you not know that Allah has power over all things?}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Meaning of Verse 2:106====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=2&amp;amp;tid=2938 The Meaning of Naskh]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir ibn Kathir|2=&#039;&#039;&#039;The Meaning of Naskh&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn Abi Talhah said that Ibn `Abbas said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;Whatever an Ayah We abrogate.&#039;&#039; Also, Ibn Jurayj said that Mujahid said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;Whatever an Ayah We erase.&#039;&#039; Also, Ibn Abi Najih said that Mujahid said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;We keep the words, but change the meaning.&#039;&#039; He related these words to the companions of `Abdullah bin Mas`ud. Ibn Abi Hatim said that similar statements were mentioned by Abu Al-`Aliyah and Muhammad bin Ka`b Al-Qurazi. Also As-Suddi said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;We erase it.&#039;&#039; Further, Ibn Abi Hatim said that it means, &amp;quot;Erase and raise it, such as erasing the following wordings (from the Qur&#039;an), `The married adulterer and the married adulteress: stone them to death,&#039; and, `If the son of Adam had two valleys of gold, he would seek a third.&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn Jarir stated that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh) means, &amp;quot;Whatever ruling we repeal in an Ayah by making the allowed unlawful and the unlawful allowed.&#039;&#039; The Nasakh only occurs with commandments, prohibitions, permissions, and so forth. As for stories, they do not undergo Nasakh. The word, `Nasakh&#039; literally means, `to copy a book&#039;. The meaning of Nasakh in the case of commandments is removing the commandment and replacing it by another. And whether the Nasakh involves the wordings, the ruling or both, it is still called Nasakh.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Allah said next,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(or Nunsiha (cause it to be forgotten)). `Ali bin Abi Talhah said that Ibn `Abbas said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do Nansakh or Nunsiha) means, &amp;quot;Whatever Ayah We repeal or uphold without change.&#039;&#039; Also, Mujahid said that the companions of Ibn Mas`ud (who read this word Nansa&#039;ha) said that it means, &amp;quot;We uphold its wording and change its ruling.&#039;&#039; Further, `Ubayd bin `Umayr, Mujahid and `Ata&#039; said, `Nansa&#039;ha&#039; means, &amp;quot;We delay it (i.e., do not abrogate it).&#039;&#039; Further, `Atiyyah Al-`Awfi said that the Ayah means, &amp;quot;We delay repealing it.&#039;&#039; This is the same Tafsir provided by As-Suddi and Ar-Rabi` bin Anas. `Abdur-Razzaq said that Ma`mar said that Qatadah said about Allah&#039;s statement,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(Whatever a verse (revelation) do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten) &amp;quot;Allah made His Prophet forget what He willed and He abrogated what He will.&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Allah&#039;s said,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one or similar to it), better, relates to the benefit provided for the one it addresses, as reported from `Ali bin Abi Talhah that Ibn `Abbas said,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one) means, &amp;quot;We bring forth a more beneficial ruling, that is also easier for you.&#039;&#039; Also, As-Suddi said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one or similar to it) means, &amp;quot;We bring forth a better Ayah, or similar to that which was repealed.&#039;&#039; Qatadah also said that,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(We bring a better one or similar to it) means, &amp;quot;We replace it by an Ayah more facilitating, permitting, commanding, or prohibiting.&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verse 13:39===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|13|39}}|Allah doth blot out or confirm what He pleaseth: with Him is the Mother of the Book.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verse 16:101===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|101}}|And when We change (one) communication for (another) communication, and Allah knows best what He reveals, they say: You are only a forger. Nay, most of them do not know.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verses 17:85-86===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|17|85|86}}|They ask thee concerning the Spirit (of inspiration). Say: &amp;quot;The Spirit (cometh) by command of my Lord: of knowledge it is only a little that is communicated to you, (O men!)&amp;quot; If it were Our Will, We could take away that which We have sent thee by inspiration:then wouldst thou find none to plead thy affair in that matter as against Us,-}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Verses 87:6-7===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|87|6|7}}|By degrees shall We teach thee to declare (the Message), so thou shalt not forget, Except as Allah wills: For He knoweth what is manifest and what is hidden.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Hadith==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sahih Bukhari===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The following [[sahih]] narration indicates their are many verses in the Qur&#039;an that have been abrogated, but all of them had to be included.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|53}}|I said to &#039;Uthman bin &#039;Affan (while he was collecting the Qur&#039;an) regarding the Verse:-- &amp;quot;Those of you who die and leave wives ...&amp;quot; (2.240) &amp;quot;&#039;&#039;&#039;This Verse was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by an other Verse. So why should you write it? (Or leave it in the Qur&#039;an)?&amp;quot; &#039;Uthman said. &amp;quot;O son of my brother! I will not shift anything of it from its place.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|33}}|They had a choice, either fast or feed a poor for every day..&amp;quot; and added, &amp;quot;This Verse is &#039;&#039;&#039;abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039;.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|32}}|That he heard Ibn &#039;Abbas reciting the Divine Verse:--&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;And for those who can fast they had a choice either fast, or feed a poor for every day..&amp;quot; (2.184) Ibn &#039;Abbas said, &amp;quot;This Verse is not abrogated, but it is meant for old men and old women who have no strength to fast, so they should feed one poor person for each day of fasting (instead of fasting).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|34}}|&amp;quot;For those who can fast, they had a choice either fast, or feed a poor for every day,&amp;quot; (2.184) was revealed, it was permissible for one to give a ransom and give up fasting, till the Verse succeeding it was revealed and abrogated it.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|54}}|&#039;Ata said: Ibn &#039;Abbas said, &amp;quot;This Verse, i.e. the Statement of Allah: &amp;quot;..without turning them out..&amp;quot; &#039;&#039;&#039;cancelled the obligation&#039;&#039;&#039; of staying for the waiting period in her dead husband&#039;s house, and she can complete this period wherever she likes}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|68}}|This Verse:--&amp;quot;Whether you show what is in your minds or conceal it..&amp;quot; (2.284) &#039;&#039;&#039;was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|6|60|69}}|A man from the companions of Allah&#039;s Apostle who I think, was Ibn &#039;Umar said, &amp;quot;The Verse:-- ‘Whether you show what is in your minds or conceal it ...’ &#039;&#039;&#039;was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by the Verse following it.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sahih Muslim===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|003|0675}}|The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) abrogated some of his commands by others, &#039;&#039;&#039;just as the Qur&#039;an abrogates&#039;&#039;&#039; some part with the other.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|4|1317}}|Al-Bara&#039; b. &#039;Azib reported: This verse was revealed (in this way): &amp;quot;Guard the prayers and the &#039;Asr prayer.&amp;quot; We recited it (in this very way) so long as Allah desired. Allah, then, abrogated it and it was revealed: &amp;quot;Guard the prayers, and the middle prayer.&amp;quot; A person who was sitting with Shaqiq (one of the narrators in the chain of transmitters) said: Now it implies the &#039;Asr prayer. Upon this al-Bara&#039; said: I have already informed you how this (verse) was revealed and how &#039;&#039;&#039;Allah abrogated it&#039;&#039;&#039;, and Allah knows best. Imam Muslim said: Ashja&#039;i narrated it from Sufyan al-Thauri, who narrated it from al-Aswad b. Qais, who narrated it from &#039;Uqba, who narrated it from al-Bara&#039; b. &#039;Azib who said: We recited with the Prophet (may peace be upon him) (the above-mentioned verse like this, i. e. instead of Salat al- Wusta, Salat al-&#039;Asr) for a certain period, as it has been mentioned (in the above-quoted hadith).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|4|1433}}|Anas b. Malik reported that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) invoked curse in the morning (prayer) for thirty days upon those who killed the Companions (of the Holy Prophet) at Bi&#039;r Ma&#039;una. He cursed (the tribes) of Ri&#039;l, Dhakwan, Lihyan, and Usayya, who had disobeyed Allah and His Messenger (may peace be upon him). Anas said: Allah the Exalted and Great revealed (a verse) regarding those who were killed at Bi&#039;r Ma&#039;una, and we recited it, till it was abrogated later on (and the verse was like this):, convey to it our people the tidings that we have met our Lord, and He was pleased with us and we were pleased with Him&amp;quot;.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|43|7173}}|Sa&#039;id b. Jubair reported: I said to Ibn Abbas: Will the repentance of that person be accepted who kills a believer intentionally? He said: No. I recited to him this verse of Sura al-Furqan (xix.): &amp;quot;And those who call not upon another god with Allah and slay not the soul which Allah has forbidden except in the cause of justice&amp;quot; to the end of the verse. He said: This is a Meccan verse which has been abrogated by a verse revealed at Medina: &amp;quot;He who slays a believer intentionally, for him is the requital of Hell-Fire where he would abide for ever,&amp;quot; and in the narration of Ibn Hisham (the words are): I recited to him this verse of Sura al-Furqan: &amp;quot;Except one who made repentance.&amp;quot; (see also Sahih al-Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 285)}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Abu Dawud===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Abudawud|5|1299}}|In Surat al-Muzzammil (73), the verse: &amp;quot;Keep vigil at night but a little, a half thereof&amp;quot; (2-3) &#039;&#039;&#039;has been abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by the following verse: &amp;quot;He knoweth that ye count it not, and turneth unto you in mercy. Recite then of the Qur&#039;an that which is easy for you&amp;quot; (v.20). The phrase &amp;quot;the vigil of the night&amp;quot; (nashi&#039;at al-layl) means the early hours of the night. They (the companions) would pray (the tahajjud prayer) in the early hours of the night.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Abudawud|1|1300}}|Ibn ‘Abbas said: When the opening verses of Surah asl-muzzammil (lxxiii.), were revealed, the Companions would pray as long as they would pray during Ramadan &#039;&#039;&#039;until its last verses were revealed&#039;&#039;&#039;.}} &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Abudawud|12|2275}}|Women who are divorced shall wait, keeping themselves apart, three monthly courses; and then said: And for such of your women as despair of menstruation, if ye doubt, their period (of waiting) shall be three months. &#039;&#039;&#039;This was abrogated from the former verse&#039;&#039;&#039;. Again he said: (O ye who believe, if ye wed believing women) and divorce them before ye have touched them, then there is no period that ye should reckon.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Al Muwatta===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Neither the abrogating nor the abrogated verses on suckling appear in the text of the Qur&#039;an today. This, along with the Qur&#039;anic [[Stoning|verse of rajm]] (stoning), were written on a piece of paper and were reportedly lost when a goat [[Qur&#039;an, Hadith and Scholars:Stoning|ate them]].&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Musnad Ahmad bin Hanbal. vol. 6. page 269; Sunan Ibn Majah, page 626; Ibn Qutbah, Tawil Mukhtalafi &#039;l-Hadith (Cairo: Maktaba al-Kulliyat al-Azhariyya. 1966) page 310; As-Suyuti, ad-Durru &#039;l-Manthur, vol. 2. page 13&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muwatta|30|3|17}}|Yahya related to me from Malik from Abdullah ibn Abi Bakr ibn Hazm from Amra bint Abd ar-Rahman that A&#039;isha, the wife of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, said, &amp;quot;Amongst what was sent down of the Qur&#039;an was &#039;ten known sucklings make haram&#039; - &#039;&#039;&#039;then it was abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; by &#039;five known sucklings&#039;. When the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, died, it was what is now recited of the Qur&#039;an.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Yahya said that Malik said, &amp;quot;One does not act on this.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muwatta|37|5|4b}}|&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Yahya said that he heard Malik say, &amp;quot;This ayat is abrogated. It is the word of Allah, the Blessed, the Exalted, &#039;If he leaves goods, the testament is for parents and kinsmen.&#039; What came down about the division of the fixed shares of inheritance in the Book of Allah, the Mighty, the Exalted, &#039;&#039;&#039;abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; it&amp;quot; ...}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Ibn Majah===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Ibn Majah Vol. 3, Book 9, Hadith 1942|It was narrated that &#039;Aishah said:&lt;br /&gt;
 &lt;br /&gt;
“Once of the things that &#039;&#039;&#039;Allah revealed in the the Qur&#039;an and then abrogated&#039;&#039;&#039; was that nothing makes marriage prohibited except ten breastfeedings or five well-known (breastfeedings).” (Sahih)}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Scholars==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Companions of Muhammad===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Ali, the fourth Rightly-guided Caliph, knowing the difference between abrogating and abrogated verses will save you from being damned.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote||Ali [&#039;Ali ibn Abi Talib]said to Abdul Rahman “can you differentiate between abrogating and abrogated verses” Abdul Rahman said, “no.” Thereupon Ali said “Thou art damned and causeth others to be damned.”&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;&#039;&#039;Annasikh-wal-Mansukh&#039;&#039;, by Abul Qasim, published by Hindia Press, Cairo, p. 6. A similar saying is found in &#039;&#039;An-Nasikh -wal- Mansukh &#039;&#039;(i.e. Abrogating &amp;amp; Abrogated), by Abu Ja&#039;afar An-Nah&#039;has, Beirut, 2003, p. 9, and &#039;&#039;Nawasikh Al-Qur&#039;an&#039;&#039; (i.e. The Abrogating of the Qur&#039;an), by Ibn Al-Jauzy, Beirut 2002, p. 24, and &#039;&#039;Al-Itqan Fi Ulum Al Qur&#039;an&#039;&#039; by Al-Suyuti, II, p. 700.&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote||&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;Although the companions of Muhammad are reported to have discussed naskh, and even to have disagreed over the abrogation of a particular verse, references to the generation of the companions in the naskh literature are relatively infrequent.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Ibn Salama, al-Nasikh wa ‘l-mansukh (Cairo 1315/1899), 142-3, where `Ali and Ibn ‘Abbas disagree over the abrogation of Quran 4:94; `Ali maintained that the verse was abrogated by Quran 4:115 and 4:48, while Ibn ‘Abbas held that it remained muhkama.&#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;A.Rippin&amp;quot;&amp;gt;(referenced by A.Rippin) [http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/abrogation-and-the-koran/ Abrogation and the Koran] - David Bukay, School of Political Science, The University of Haifa&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Early Scholars===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote||&amp;quot;The number of verses that are considered to have been abrogated increased dramatically between the eighth and eleventh centuries (al-Zuhri mentions 42 abrogated verses, al-Nahhas 138, and Ibn Salama, 238), at which point an upper limit seems to have been reached (Ibn ‘Ata’iqi identifies 231 abrogated verses, and al-Farsi, 248). &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
- &amp;quot;al-Suyuti (d. 911/1505) recognised only twenty [20] instances of true abrogation and Shah Wali Allah (d 1762) reduced that number to five [5].&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;these figures are mentioned in Ernest Hahn, ‘Sir Sayyid Ahmad Khan’s The Controversy over Abrogation (in the Qur’an)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn al-’Ata’iqi, on the other hand, while citing 231 instances of abrogation, appendixes the phrase wa fihi nazar, indicating doubt or uncertainty to his discussion of twenty-six verses.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
.....&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
- &amp;quot;There is also considerable disagreement over the scope of abrogation within the Qur’an itself. At one extreme, there were apparently certain people who argued that ‘the Qur’an does not contain either an abrogated or an abrogating verse’.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(&amp;quot;Ibn Salama, p. 26; cf. Al-Nahhas, pp 2-3&amp;quot;), these people, according to Ibn Salama, ‘&#039;&#039;&#039;have deviated from the truth&#039;&#039;&#039; and by virtue of their lying, have turned away from God’. (&amp;quot;Ibn Salama, p. 26)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
At the other extreme were those scholars who maintained that any narrative, positive command, or prohibition in the Qur’an may be abrogated.&amp;quot; (&amp;quot;Al-Nahhas, pp. 2-3&amp;quot;)&amp;lt;ref name=&amp;quot;A.Rippin&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Ibn Salma , those who reject abrogation have deviated from the truth. Once again, its improtant to note at the time of the caliphate, some scholars (particularly a preacher from Kufa, Iraq) were banned from explaining and preaching the Qur&#039;ān by early &#039;ilmic authority figures because of their ignorance of the principles of naskh.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Modern Scholars===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://mac.abc.se/home/onesr/ez/in/it1/Abrogation_Hadith.txt Abrogation and Hadith]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Shaykh Gibril Fouad Haddad, living islam, December 23, 2008|Naskh is a fact since Allah Most High said &amp;quot;We do not erase (nansakh) any aya or cause it to be forgotten (nunsiha) but bring a better one or the like of it&amp;quot; (2:106).&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Second, the mutual abrogability of the Qur&#039;an and the Sunna (i) is rationally possible - since the Qur&#039;an describes the Sunna as revealed as well: &amp;quot;Nor does he speak of his own desire&amp;quot; (53:3) - and &lt;br /&gt;
(ii) occurs in the Law, as per the abrogation of the verse of bequest (2:180) by the mass-transmitted hadith &amp;quot;There is no bequest for anyone who stands to inherit.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Imam al-Shafi`i famously dissented with the massive majority of the Scholars when he said that only the Qur&#039;an abrogates the Qur&#039;an and only the Sunna abrogates the Sunna, but his School did not follow him in this cf. Imam al-Haramayn in Mughith al-Khalq and the contemporary Shaykh Hasan Hitu in al-Wajiz fi Usul al-Tashri` al-Islami, both staunch Shafi`is.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
We should be aware that in recent times the tendency has been toward minimalism, much of it a reaction to Orientalist and other attempts to construe naskh as a literary rewrite invalidating Divine origin, some Muslim revisionists even forwarding the view that there is no &lt;br /&gt;
abrogation in the Qur&#039;an. However, of the 60-odd teatises written on abrogation there is no precedent for such an extreme view. The number of cases hovers around 200, peaking at 247 with Ibn al-Jawzi, 214 with Ibn Hazm and 213 with Hibat Allah ibn Salama while falling to 134 with al-Nahhas and only 66 with `Abd al-Qahir al-Baghdadi.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Mu`tazili grammarian and author of the Qur&#039;anic commentary Jami` al-Ta&#039;wil li-Muhkam al-Tanzil, Abu Muslim al-Asfahani (254-322), was reputed to have denied intra-Qur&#039;anic naskh altogether. Al-Razi and al-Shawkani refuted him in al-Mahsul and Irshad al-Fusul respectively, but others (such as Ibn Daqiq al-`Id and the contemporary scholar `Ali Hasabullah) justified his stance as a difference in terminology only (khilaf lafzi) - due, for example, to interpreting the word aya as &amp;quot;(super)natural sign&amp;quot; or &amp;quot;previous Scriptures&amp;quot; rather than &amp;quot;Qur&#039;anic verse,&amp;quot; or a reconsideration of purported abrogation to be mere specification (ikhtisas). Hence al-Qarafi&#039;s rebuttal, when al-Razi questioned the claim of consensus on the existence of abrogation: &amp;quot;Agreement has indeed formed over meaning; difference is only over naming.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Misinformation Spread by Apologists==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Only Meccan Verses are Universal Commands===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
When you understand abrogation, you understand what drives Islamic [[terrorism]] and extremism. This has led some apologists to flatly deny they are even aware of such a concept existing within Islam. Some have even attempted to create their own methods in choosing which verses apply to today&#039;s world. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
One such example of this is the reversal of the truth; it is the obscure and baseless claim that the Medinan verses are read only in an historical and non-legal context, while the less violent Meccan verses are universal commands. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This in itself is not a negative thing, but when they try to pass this off to non-Muslims as authentic Islam and claim this is widely accepted by Islamic scholars, while never attempting to rectify the alleged misconceptions with their co-religionists, it is nothing more than [[Islam and Propaganda|deceptive propaganda]]. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Furthermore,  theologically this claim makes zero sense. It contradicts several sahih hadith, and {{cite quran|5|90|end=91|style=ref}} which prohibit the consumption of Alcohol and gambling, are Medinan verses.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Allamah Abu &#039;Abd Allah al-Zanjani - [{{Reference archive|1=http://tanzil.net/pub/ebooks/History-of-Quran.pdf|2=2011-05-13}} The History of the Quran] - Al-Tawheed Vol. 4, No. 3; Vol. 5, No. 1, 2, &amp;amp; 3&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;[{{Reference archive|1=http://www.qran.org/q-chrono.htm|2=2011-05-13}} Quran Verses in Chronological Order] - Qran.org, accessed May 13, 2011&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Kevin P. Edgecomb - [{{Reference archive|1=http://www.bombaxo.com/chronsurs.html|2=2011-05-13}} Chronological Order of Quranic Surahs] - Bombaxo, 2002&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;[{{Reference archive|1=http://www.masjidtucson.org/quran/chapters_chronological_sequence.html|2=2011-05-13}} Quran Chapters and their Chronological Sequence of Revelation] - International Community of Submitters (ICS)&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;[{{Reference archive|1=http://tanzil.net/wiki/Revelation_Order|2=2011-05-13}} Revelation Order] - Tanzil Project, accessed May 13, 2011&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Prior to the revelation of these verses, there were [[Intoxicants and Recreational Games|no prohibitions]] against intoxicants and games of chance. So when is the last time you have heard Muslims claiming drinking alcohol and gambling is permitted in Islam today?&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Abrogation Exists Only Between the Qur&#039;an and Previous Scriptures===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Many modern apologists assert that abrogation does not exist within the Qur&#039;an itself, but that the abrogation mentioned in {{Quran|2|106}} and {{Quran|16|101}} refers to the Qur&#039;an replacing directives given in the [[Taurat]] and [[Injil]]. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Although this understanding has already been shown to be in error by Ibn Kathir&#039;s commentary [[#Meaning of Verse 2:106|here]], let us take a look at these verses in context.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{cite quran|16|101|end=104|style=ref}} |&#039;&#039;&#039;And when We change (one) communication for (another) communication, and Allah knows best what He reveals, they say: You are only a forger. Nay, most of them do not know&#039;&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Say: The Holy spirit has revealed it from your Lord&#039;&#039;&#039; with the truth, that it may establish those who believe and as a guidance and good news for those who submit. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
And certainly We know that they say: &#039;&#039;&#039;Only a mortal teaches him&#039;&#039;&#039;. The tongue of him whom they reproach is barbarous, and this is clear Arabic tongue. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
(As for) those who do not believe in Allah&#039;s communications, surely Allah will not guide them, and they shall have a painful punishment.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to Islam, the Book of Musa was revealed from Allah to Moses (not via the Qur&#039;an&#039;s “Holy Spirit” which is Jibreel, an Angel). The Gospels which the Qur&#039;an talks about were written by people who were there, or revealed in visions from Allah etc. Again no angels were involved with the revelation of the previous scriptures. So verse 16:101 is clearly talking about Muhammad and the revelation of the Qur&#039;an after talking about abrogation. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{cite quran|2|105|end=108|style=ref}} |Those who disbelieve from among the followers of the Book do not like, nor do the polytheists, that the good should be sent down to you from your Lord, and Allah chooses especially whom He pleases for His mercy, and Allah is the Lord of mighty grace. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Whatever communications We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, We bring one better than it or like it. Do you not know that Allah has power over all things?&#039;&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Do you not know that Allah&#039;s is the kingdom of the heavens and the earth, and that besides Allah you have no guardian or helper? &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Rather you wish to put questions &#039;&#039;to your Messenger&#039;&#039;&#039;&#039;&#039;, as Musa was questioned before; and whoever adopts unbelief instead of faith, he indeed has lost the right direction of the way.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Verse 2:106 in context is clearly talking about those who questioned Muhammad about his contradictions, hence the revelation regarding “abrogation”. This has nothing to do with the “previous scriptures” either. So far its abrogation within the Qur&#039;an itself. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Looking at verse 2:136, Allah says there is no distinction between the previous messages.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|136}}|Say: We believe in Allah and (in) that which had been revealed to us, and (in) that which was revealed to Ibrahim and Ismail and Ishaq and Yaqoub and the tribes, and (in) that which was given to Musa and Isa, and (in) that which was given to the prophets from their Lord, &#039;&#039;&#039;we do not make any distinction between any of them&#039;&#039;&#039;, and to Him do we submit.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Since [[Jesus|Isa]] never wrote a book, we can infer that Allah is talking about the Injil, and Musa; the Taurat. Why would Allah “make no distinction” between them if he had abrogated parts of it? Surely he would have seen fit to mention “except the parts we have substituted”?&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Examples of Abrogation==&lt;br /&gt;
{{main|List of Abrogations in the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Let there be no compulsion in religion===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Verse 2:256&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|256}}|2=Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Meaning of Verse 2:256&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Tafsir Ibn Kathir (unabridged)|Allah says: &amp;quot;There is no compulsion in religion&amp;quot;, meaning: do not force anyone to embrace Islam, because it is clear and its proofs and evidences are manifest. Whoever Allah guides and opens his heart to Islam has indeed embraced it with clear evidence. Whoever Allah misguides blinds his heart and has set a seal on his hearing and a covering on his eyes cannot embrace Islam by force...hence Allah revealed this verse. &#039;&#039;&#039;But, this verse is abrogated by the verse of &amp;quot;fighting...Therefore, all people of the world should be called to Islam. If anyone of them refuses to do so, or refuses to pay the Jizya they should be fought till they are killed. This is the meaning of compulsion.&#039;&#039;&#039; In the Sahih, the Prophet said: &amp;quot;Allah wonders at those people who will enter Paradise in chains&amp;quot;, meaning prisoners brought in chains to the Islamic state, then they embrace Islam sincerely and become righteous, and are entered among the people of Paradise.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;David Bukay - [http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/abrogation-and-the-koran/ Abrogation and the Koran] - School of Political Science, The University of Haifa&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Sam Shamoun and Jochen Katz - [http://www.answering-islam.org/Responses/Menj/taqiyyah.htm Sunni Muslims and Taqiyyah] - Answering Islam&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===If they incline towards peace, you incline also===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Verse 8:60&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|8|61}}|But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in Allah: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Meaning of Verse 8:60&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=1&amp;amp;tTafsirNo=74&amp;amp;tSoraNo=8&amp;amp;tAyahNo=61&amp;amp;tDisplay=yes&amp;amp;Languageid=2 Surat Al-&#039;Anfāl (The Spoils of War) 8:61]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Ibn Abbas in Tafsir Ibn Abbas and Tafsir al-Jalalayn (Suyuti) |2=‘This has been abrogated by the “sword verse” [Q. 9:5]’}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Scholars on 8:60&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Ibn Taymiyyah, ‘Governance According to Allaah’s Law in Reforming the Ruler and his Flock’|&amp;quot;It is the consensus of the scholars of this Ummah that if part of the religion is Allah&#039;s and other part is not, fighting must go on until the entire religion is Allah&#039;s&amp;quot;.&amp;lt;ref&amp;gt;Shaykh ul-Islaam Taqi ud-Deen Ahmad ibn Taymiyyah - &#039;[http://www.fisabeelillah.org/books/manhaj/The-Religious-And-Moral-Doctrine-Of-Jihad.pdf The Religious and Moral Doctrine of Jihaad]&#039; - p.28, © Copyright 2001 Maktabah Al Ansaar Publications, ISBN: 0-9539847-5-3&amp;lt;/ref&amp;gt;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://www.religioscope.com/info/doc/jihad/azzam_caravan_1_foreword.htm  Join The Caravan, p.9]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Imam Abdullah Azzam|&amp;quot;Jihad and the rifle alone. NO negotiations, NO conferences and NO dialogue.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://www.religioscope.com/info/doc/jihad/azzam_caravan_1_foreword.htm  Join The Caravan, p.20]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Imam Abdullah Azzam|&amp;quot;So, if the fighting stops, the disbelievers will dominate, and fitnah, which is Shirk (polytheism), will spread.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Fight those who fight you, Allah hates aggressors===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Verse 2:190&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|190}}|Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Meaning of verse 2:190&#039;&#039;&#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|[http://quran.com/2/190 Surat Al-Baqarah (The Cow) 2:190]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir al jalayn (Suyuti)|this stipulation was abrogated by the verse of barā’a, ‘immunity’ [Q. 9:1], or by His saying [below]:}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=2&amp;amp;tid=4985 The Command to fight Those Who fight Muslims and killing Them wherever They are found]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir Ibn Kathir|2=(And fight in the way of Allah those who fight you,)&lt;br /&gt;
Abu Al-`Aliyah said, &amp;quot;This was the first Ayah about fighting that was revealed in Al-Madinah. Ever since it was revealed, Allah&#039;s Messenger &#039;&#039;&#039;used to&#039;&#039;&#039; fight only those who fought him and avoid non-combatants. Later, Surat Bara&#039;ah (chapter 9 in the Qur&#039;an) was revealed.&amp;quot; `Abdur-Rahman bin Zayd bin Aslam said similarly, then he said that this was later &#039;&#039;&#039;abrogated by the Ayah&#039;&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Conclusion==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Surah Tawbah is the last Surah of the Qur&#039;an===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;Al Taubah&#039;&#039;&#039; (Repentance) is considered to be the [[The Ultimate Message of the Qur&#039;an|closing remarks]] of Allah. It is also the most aggressive chapter of the entire Qur&#039;an.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|11|3941}}|Abu Ishaq said that he heard al-Bara&#039; b &#039;Azib (Allah be pleased with him) say: The last complete sura revealed (in the Holy Qur&#039;an) is Sura tauba (i e. al-Bara&#039;at, ix.), and the last verse revealed is that pertaining to &#039;&#039;&#039;Kalala&#039;&#039;&#039;.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|4|176}}|(*They ask you for a legal verdict. Say: &amp;quot;Allah directs (thus) about Al-Kalalah- )|}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Surah Tawbah cancels all peace treaties===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=9&amp;amp;tid=20750 This is the Ayah of the Sword]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir ibn Kathir|2=&amp;quot;Ibn `Umar said that the Messenger of Allah said,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;&#039;&#039;I have been commanded to fight the people until they testify that there is no deity worthy of worship except Allah and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, establish the prayer and pay the Zakah.&#039;&#039;&#039; &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This honorable Ayah (9:5) was called the Ayah of the Sword, about which Ad-Dahhak bin Muzahim said, &#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;quot;It abrogated every agreement of peace between the Prophet and any idolator, every treaty, and every term.&#039;&#039;&#039;&amp;quot; Al-`Awfi said that Ibn `Abbas commented: &amp;quot;No idolator had any more treaty or promise of safety ever since Surah Bara&#039;ah was revealed. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Core Scripture}}&lt;br /&gt;
==See Also==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Hub4|Abrogation|Abrogation}}&lt;br /&gt;
*[[Qur&#039;an, Hadith and Scholars:Islamic Theology]]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==External Links==&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.meforum.org/1754/peace-or-jihad-abrogation-in-islam Peace or Jihad? Abrogation in Islam]&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/abrogation-and-the-koran/ Abrogation and the Koran]&lt;br /&gt;
*[http://www.fatherzakaria.net/books/qaf/pdf/22-Episode.pdf Examples of the Abrogation]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==References==&lt;br /&gt;
{{reflist}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Qur&#039;an]]&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Jihad and Terrorism]]&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran&amp;diff=107444</id>
		<title>Scientific Errors in the Quran</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://wikiislamica.net/index.php?title=Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran&amp;diff=107444"/>
		<updated>2014-05-14T16:44:02Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Nightmare140: /* Geocentricism */ There are some translation errors in addition to things that are not even mistakes but rather misunderstood words&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;hr /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;{{under review}}&lt;br /&gt;
Muslims believe that the [[Qur&#039;an]] contains a message from an all-powerful, all-knowing, infallible being. If this is true then it should not contain any [[Contradictions and Errors|errors, mistakes]], or information that contradicts known facts about the universe. If even one error exists in the text of [[Islam]]&#039;s holy book then the claims of divine authorship and infallibility are not true. An objective evaluation of the Qur’an shows that it contains numerous [[Islam and Science|scientific]] and historical errors and it reflects a pre-scientific, 7&amp;lt;sup&amp;gt;th&amp;lt;/sup&amp;gt; century view of the natural world.&lt;br /&gt;
  &lt;br /&gt;
Some apologists will contest these numerous scientific errors in the Qur&#039;an by appealing to metaphor, alternative meanings, or [[w:Phenomenology (philosophy)|phenomenological]] interpretations of the text. Even if we suppose that alternative explanations were possible in every case, the wording and content of the Qur&#039;anic verses often mimic the popular mythology and unscientific misconceptions of the time in which they were recorded. The author of the Qur’an makes no clear or unambiguous statements that differentiate his understanding of the natural world from the common folklore of the people living in the 7&amp;lt;sup&amp;gt;th&amp;lt;/sup&amp;gt; century. If the Qur’an was delivered by an all-powerful, all-knowing being then he would have been able to foresee how such ambiguous and misleading statements would be understood by future generations and the doubts and confusions they would cause. This alone should be reason to reject any claims to its divine authorship.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Astronomy==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
=== Geocentricism===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Geocentrism and the Quran|l1=Geocentrism and the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an mentions numerous times that the sun and the moon travel in an orbit, but does not mention once that the earth does too. This is consistent with a earth-centered (geocentric) view of the cosmos that places a motionless earth at the center of the universe and all &amp;quot;heavenly bodies&amp;quot; travel around the earth. This was the prevailing understanding of the universe prior to the 16&amp;lt;sup&amp;gt;th&amp;lt;/sup&amp;gt; century when Copernicus helped explain and popularize a sun-centered (heliocentric) view of the universe. Tellingly, the sun&#039;s orbit is always mentioned in the context of night and day.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|36|38}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And the Sun runs his course for a period determined for him: that is the decree of (Him) the Exalted in Might, the All-Knowing.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|36|40}}|&lt;br /&gt;
It is not for the sun to overtake the moon, nor doth the night outstrip the day. They float each in an orbit. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some apologists try to explain away the Qur&#039;anic description of the sun moving in an orbit as a reference to our sun orbiting the black hole at the center of the milky way galaxy every 225 million years. This is an [[w:Ad hoc hypothesis|Ad hoc hypothesis]], of no relevance to human time scales, and nothing from the text implies that the sun is orbiting anything other than the earth. If the author had knowledge of the sun orbiting a black hole then it is conspicuous that he never mentions it explicitly nor in any way differentiates the sun&#039;s orbit from that of the moon.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
In the Qur&#039;an, the moon and the sun orbit the earth together. There is no distinction made between the moon, which actually revolves around the earth, and the sun which only appears to revolve around the earth when in fact the suns movement through the sky is a product of the rotation of the earth around its axis.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|91|1-2}}|&lt;br /&gt;
By the Sun and his (glorious) splendour; By the Moon as she follows him; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|21|33}}|And He it is Who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon. They float, each in an orbit.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|14|33}}|And maketh the sun and the moon, constant in their courses, to be of service unto you, and hath made of service unto you the night and the day. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an emphasizes that the earth is fixed in place and motionless. He is clearly unaware that the earth is not only revolving around the sun, but also spinning on its own axis.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|35|41}}|Lo! Allah graspeth the heavens and the earth &#039;&#039;&#039;that they deviate not&#039;&#039;&#039;, and &#039;&#039;&#039;if they were to deviate&#039;&#039;&#039; there is not one that could grasp them after Him. Lo! He is ever Clement, Forgiving.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;!-- {{Quote|{{Quran|40|64}}|It is God who made for you the earth &#039;&#039;&#039;a fixed place&#039;&#039;&#039; and heaven for an edifice; And He shaped you, and shaped you well, and provided you with the good things. That then is God, your Lord, so blessed be God, the Lord of all Being.}} --&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Response: What was said here is just illogically interpreting verses. It is not understandable how mentioning the movements of both the Sun and moon without the Earth makes it &amp;quot;an error&amp;quot;. The old beliefs were that both the Sun and the moon orbit around the Earth but this is not mentioned likewise in the Qur&#039;an. As for responding for the examples from Qur&#039;an that were given:&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The first verse: {{Quote|{{Quran|36|38}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And the Sun runs his course for a period determined for him: that is the decree of (Him) the Exalted in Might, the All-Knowing.}}&lt;br /&gt;
This verse only mentions that the Sun moves (and the word used in Arabic to describe the motion of the Sun has the meaning of moving just like a horse moves) and has nothing wrong in it.   &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The 2nd verse: {{Quote|{{Quran|36|40}}|&lt;br /&gt;
It is not for the sun to overtake the moon, nor doth the night outstrip the day. They float each in an orbit. }}&lt;br /&gt;
It merely states that both the Sun and the moon move in orbits. Nothing is wrong with that. And on a side note, orbits in Arabic are usually referred to as مدار which is a circular (or oval) kind of orbit, but it&#039;s not used as such in the Qur&#039;an. The word used is فلك which doesn&#039;t specify the trajectory&#039;s shape.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
As for this group of verses: {{Quote|{{Quran-range|91|1-2}}|&lt;br /&gt;
By the Sun and his (glorious) splendour; By the Moon as she follows him; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|21|33}}|And He it is Who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon. They float, each in an orbit.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|14|33}}|And maketh the sun and the moon, constant in their courses, to be of service unto you, and hath made of service unto you the night and the day. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
These verses don&#039;t contain any piece of information that is rejected by science. They also only state that the Sun and moon have orbits.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
As for the last 2 verses, the ones that were shown as evidence that Qur&#039;an views Earth as fixed and motionless: &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
the first verse:{{Quote|{{Quran|35|41}}|Lo! Allah graspeth the heavens and the earth &#039;&#039;&#039;that they deviate not&#039;&#039;&#039;, and &#039;&#039;&#039;if they were to deviate&#039;&#039;&#039; there is not one that could grasp them after Him. Lo! He is ever Clement, Forgiving.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This is clearly a translation error. It is not &amp;quot;that they deviate not&amp;quot; but would have been a better translation as &amp;quot;that they vanish not&amp;quot; because the word used is تزولا which almost has the same meaning of vanish or be gone. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
As for the last verse mentioned,{{Quote|{{Quran|40|64}}|It is God who made for you the earth &#039;&#039;&#039;a fixed place&#039;&#039;&#039; and heaven for an edifice; And He shaped you, and shaped you well, and provided you with the good things. That then is God, your Lord, so blessed be God, the Lord of all Being.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
 This verse is mistranslated too. Words in Arabic have various understood meanings and the meanings that can be understood from the word describing Earth are various too. The 2 that are mostly understood are &amp;quot;fixed&amp;quot; and &amp;quot;a place of settlement and rest&amp;quot;, so if &amp;quot;fixed&amp;quot; is eliminated, it can be easily said that the meaning is &amp;quot;a place of settlement&amp;quot;, so it&#039;s nothing like a mistake.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Setting and Rising Place of the Sun===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Dhul-Qarnayn and the Sun Setting in a Muddy Spring}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an assumes a flat earth which has a fixed place where the sun sets and a fixed place where the sun rises again. Since the earth is a rotating sphere, the sun does not set in any particular place and you can never travel to &amp;quot;the spot&amp;quot; where the sun sets nor a place where it rises; the sun appears to set or rise on the horizon no matter where you are on the planet. In these verses, the author propagates a popular legend from the 6th century of a man named Dhul-Qarnayn who visits the places where the sun sets and rises; here he finds the sun going down into a muddy spring and later rising on a tribe with no coverings. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|18|86}}|&lt;br /&gt;
 Till, when he reached the setting-place of the sun, he found it setting in a muddy spring, and found a people thereabout. We said: O Dhu&#039;l-Qarneyn! Either punish or show them kindness. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|18|90}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Till, when he reached the rising-place of the sun, he found it rising on a people for whom We had appointed no shelter therefrom. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some Muslim Apologists have come up with creative interpretations of these verses to say that Dhul-Qrnayn only traveled until he reached &amp;quot;the west&amp;quot; or to a spot &amp;quot;at the time&amp;quot; when the sun set and not the &amp;quot;place&amp;quot; where the sun set. Unfortunately, these alternative interpretations are severely undermined by the [[Dhul-Qarnayn_and_the_Sun_Setting_in_a_Muddy_Spring_-_Part_One#First_interpretation:_He_reached_the_west_and_east|context and Arabic words]] used in these verses, which instead point to a physical location. Again, we must ask why an all-knowing being would use such misleading verses that mimic the misconceptions and legends prevalent at the time if one of these alternative explanations is correct.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Stars are Missiles Shot at Devils===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Mistranslations of Quran 67-5|l1=Mistranslations of Qur&#039;an 67:5}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an does not seem to know the difference between stars (giant balls of gas thousands of times larger than the earth) and meteorites which are small rocky masses of debris which brighten up after entering the earth&#039;s atmosphere. Many ancient people confused the two, as meteorites look like stars that are streaking across the sky; this is why there were often called [[w:Meteoroid|shooting stars]] or falling stars. In the following verse, the Qur&#039;an claims that Allah uses stars as missiles to ward away devils. This repeats a common Arab myth at the time the Qur&#039;an was first recited.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|67|5}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And verily We have beautified the world&#039;s heaven with stars/lamps, and We have made them missiles for the devils, and for them We have prepared the doom of flame. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|37|10}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Except such as snatch away something by stealth, and they are pursued by a flaming fire, of piercing brightness.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Moon is Further from the Earth than the Stars===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Cosmology of the Quran|l1=Cosmology of the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an claims that the moon is located in the middle of the universe and stars are in the nearest/lowest part of the universe. [[w:List of nearest stars|The nearest star]] to our solar system is 4.24 light years (4x10&amp;lt;sup&amp;gt;13&amp;lt;/sup&amp;gt;km) away and over 100 million times further away then the moon. Clearly the Qur&#039;anic author has no idea that the vast majority of stars in the night sky are billions upon billions of light-years away. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|71|15-16}}|&lt;br /&gt;
See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another,&lt;br /&gt;
&#039;And made the moon a light in their &#039;&#039;&#039;midst&#039;&#039;&#039;, and made the sun as a (Glorious) Lamp}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|37|6}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Surely We have adorned the nearest heaven with an adornment, the stars}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Moon Emits Light===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The moon does not emit its own light but simply reflects light coming from the Sun. The Arabic word for reflected (in`ikaas) does not appear in this Qur&#039;anic verse that says the Moon is a &amp;quot;light&amp;quot;. It instead uses the word &amp;quot;Noor&amp;quot; which is used to denote an entity that emits light&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|71|16}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And hath made the moon a light therein, and made the sun a lamp?}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The word &amp;quot;Noor&amp;quot; is also used in these verse to show that Allah is the &amp;quot;light&amp;quot; of the universe. Clearly the author is not implying that Allah reflects light from another source but is the source of the light.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|24|35}}|&lt;br /&gt;
 Allah is the Light of the heavens and the earth. The Parable of His Light is as if there were a Niche and within it a Lamp: the Lamp enclosed in Glass: the glass as it were a brilliant star: Lit from a blessed Tree, an Olive, neither of the east nor of the west, whose oil is well-nigh luminous, though fire scarce touched it: Light upon Light! Allah doth guide whom He will to His Light: Allah doth set forth Parables for men: and Allah doth know all things.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Moon was Split in Two===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Moon Split Miracle}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an and Hadith claim that the moon was miraculously split into two pieces and then, presumably, put back together again. There is absolutely no scientific evidence whatsoever that the moon has ever been split into two. Since the moon is visible to half the planet at any given time, we should expect to see numerous accounts from different parts of the world attesting to this event if it actually happened. The Romans, Greeks, Egyptians, Persians, Chinese and Indians had avid astronomers who should have seen this event and recorded it in their histories. The absence of historical record from other civilizations, contemporary to Muhammad, is a strong indication that this event never happened.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|54|1-3}}|The hour drew nigh and the moon did rend asunder. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|4|56|831}}|Narrated Anas: &amp;quot;That the Meccan people requested Allah&#039;s Apostle to show them a miracle, and so he showed them the splitting of the moon.&amp;quot;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
=== Sun, Moon and Stars Created for Humans===&lt;br /&gt;
The sun, moon and stars are much older than humans. But the Qur&#039;an states their created purpose is for timekeeping and navigation.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|10|5}}|It is He Who made the sun to be a shining glory and the moon to be a light (of beauty), and measured out stages for her; that ye might know the number of years and the count (of time).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|189}}|They ask thee concerning the New Moons. Say: They are but signs to mark fixed periods of time in (the affairs of) men, and for Pilgrimage.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|6|96}}|He it is that cleaveth the day-break (from the dark): He makes the night for rest and tranquillity, and the sun and moon for the reckoning (of time): Such is the judgment and ordering of (Him), the Exalted in Power, the Omniscient. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|6|97}}|It is He Who maketh the stars (as beacons) for you, that ye may guide yourselves, with their help, through the dark spaces of land and sea: We detail Our signs for people who know. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
=== Night is a Veil ===	&lt;br /&gt;
Night is just the darkness of space as seen from the earth due its rotation. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|7|54}}| Your Guardian-Lord is Allah, who created the heavens and the earth in six days, and is firmly established on the throne (of authority): He draweth the night as a veil o&#039;er the day, each seeking the other in rapid succession:  }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Seven Planets in the Universe===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Cosmology of the Quran|l1=Cosmology of the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This verse claims there are seven planets. However, according to astronomers, there are eight ordinary planets and five dwarf planets, which leaves the grand total at thirteen in our solar system. Modern astronomy also has found hundreds of other planets in other solar systems and Cosmologists estimate that hundreds of billions of stars and planets exist in the universe. The author of the Qur&#039;an singling out such a small number of celestial objects only reaffirms his ignorance of the makeup of the universe.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|65|12}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Allah is He Who created seven Firmaments and of the earth a &#039;&#039;&#039;similar number&#039;&#039;&#039;. Through the midst of them (all) descends His Command: that ye may know that Allah has power over all things, and that Allah comprehends, all things in (His) Knowledge. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The paternal cousin of Muhammad and conspicuous expert on [[tafsir]] (interpretation of the Qur&#039;an) writes that Allah means that all 7 planets are flat planets.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Tafsir Ibn-Abass | Allah is He who created 7 heavens one above the other like a dome, and of the Earths, the like thereof, 7 planets but &#039;&#039;&#039;they are flat&#039;&#039;&#039;}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Seven Heavens===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Cosmology of the Quran|l1=Cosmology of the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The universe consists of hundreds of billions of galaxies, each with hundreds of billions of stars. There is no such thing as seven layers to the universe. This myth of seven heavens was a common idea prevalent in the Middle East during the time when the Qur&#039;an was first recited.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|71|15}}|&lt;br /&gt;
See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
There are only 5 not 7 principal layers to the [[W:Atmosphere of Earth|Earth&#039;s atmosphere]], and likewise only 5 not 7 major layers to the Earth itself.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|65|12}}|Allah is He Who created seven heavens, and of the earth the like of them; the decree continues to descend among them, that you may know that Allah has power over all things and that Allah indeed encompasses all things in (His) knowledge.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Earth Created in Six Days===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Qur&#039;an, Hadith and Scholars:Creation}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The earth first formed around 9 billion years after the Big Bang. The Qur&#039;an, however, repeats the prevailing middle eastern myth that the earth and universe were formed in six days. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|50|38}}|&lt;br /&gt;
We created the heavens and the earth and all between them in Six Days, nor did any sense of weariness touch Us}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Muslim apologists try and rescue the Qur&#039;an by pointing to an alternative meaning of the Arabic word &#039;yawm&#039; which typically means &#039;day&#039; but can sometimes mean &#039;time period&#039;. However the predominant meaning of the word is day and when a specific number is used, in this case six, the word almost always means a literal 24-hour day. Again, nothing in the context of the verses, nor the Qur&#039;an in general, suggests the universe or earth were formed over long time periods. It would have been trivial for an all-knowing diety to simply state that the universe was first formed over [[w:Age of the universe|13.8 billion years ago]]. However, this information is conspicuously missing.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Earth Created before Stars===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an is also unaware that the [[w:Abundance of elements in Earth&#039;s crust|elements in the Earth&#039;s crust]] and core were first formed in stars. Modern science has proposed that all the elements that make up the earth (Oxygen, Nitrogen, Carbon, Iron, etc.) was originally formed by [[w:Nucleosynthesis|nucleosynthesis]] in stars and then expelled into the universe when those stars [[w:Supernova|supernova]]. Yet the Qur&#039;an describes the earth being formed before the stars and from &amp;quot;smoke&amp;quot; or material that pre-dates stars. All rocky and gaseous planets in the universe were formed in a similar manner to the earth and the Qur&#039;an singling out the earth only further highlights the authors ignorance of the history of the formation of celestial objects.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|29}}|&lt;br /&gt;
He it is Who created for you all that is in the earth. Then turned He to the heaven, and fashioned it as seven heavens. And He is knower of all things. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|21|30}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Do not the Unbelievers see that the heavens and the earth were joined together (as one unit of creation), before we clove them asunder? We made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe? }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|41|11}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Moreover He comprehended in His design the sky, and it had been (as) smoke: He said to it and to the earth: &amp;quot;Come ye together, willingly or unwillingly.&amp;quot; They said: &amp;quot;We do come (together), in willing obedience.&amp;quot; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===The Cause of Shadows===&lt;br /&gt;
Shadows are produced when the sun&#039;s light is blocked by an obstacle. It is the Earth&#039;s rotation that causes these shadows to change size and location. However, by calling the sun the guide of shadows, this verse claims shadows are caused due to the sun&#039;s movement. A non-living &amp;quot;guide&amp;quot; can have two meanings: a controller of movement or an indicator. Other translations of this verse do call the sun an indicator but this is also unscientific because the sun cannot &#039;&#039;indicate&#039;&#039; them.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|25|45-46}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Hast thou not turned thy vision to thy Lord?- How He doth prolong the shadow! If He willed, He could make it stationary! then do We make the sun its guide; Then We draw it in towards Ourselves,- a contraction by easy stages.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Further, this verse suggests that shadows can be made stationary i.e. the rotation of the earth can be stopped. This is not possible. Then the next verse says that shadows are drawn towards Allah which has no scientific meaning.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sun is a Flat Disk===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This verse suggests that the Sun is flat and can be folded up. The Sun appears as a flat disc from the perspective of a person on earth, but the [[w:Sun|sun]] is in fact almost a perfect sphere. The verse implies the authors ignorance of this fact.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|81|1}}|&lt;br /&gt;
When the sun (with its spacious light) is folded up}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sky is a Tent/Dome===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A common myth at the time of the Quran&#039;s composition was that the sky or heavens were held up with pillars. Many Bedouin people living in Arabia imagined the sky as a large tent covering, similar to the tents they used. The author repeats this myth by describing the sky as being &amp;quot;raised&amp;quot; above the earth.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|22}}|&lt;br /&gt;
It is He Who made the Earth a couch for you, and the sky a dome.}}  &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|13|2}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Allah is He Who raised the heavens without any pillars that ye can see}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
In another verse, the author says that the sky has a covering.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|81|11}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And when the heaven has its covering removed,}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sky Guards the Earth===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Asteroids and meteorites have penetrated the atmosphere and hit the earth throughout the course of history. This includes the [[w:Chicxulub crater|massive meteorite]] that hit near the [[w:Yucatán Peninsula|Yucatán Peninsula]] 65 million years which killed off numerous species including most dinosaurs. There is no guardian, whatsoever, that prevents these types of events form happening.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|21|32}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And We have made the heavens as a canopy well guarded: yet do they turn away from the Signs which these things (point to)}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sky can Fall Down on People===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an author thought that the sky is like a ceiling that can fall on someone while the earth can swallow someone too. This is obviously impossible as the earth&#039;s atmosphere is simply made of gas.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|34|9}}|See they not what is before them and behind them, of the sky and the earth? If We wished, We could cause the earth to swallow them up, or cause a piece of the sky to fall upon them. Verily in this is a Sign for every devotee that turns to Allah (in repentance).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sky can be Rolled Up===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This is another verse implying that the sky or heaven is something solid.&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|21|104}}|The Day when We shall roll up the heavens as a recorder rolleth up a written scroll. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Ignorance of the North and South Poles===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|The Ramadan Pole Paradox}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
In polar regions, the longevity of day and night vary during summer and winter. Muhammad didn&#039;t know about this and he only repeated earlier geocentric ideas. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|36|40}}|&lt;br /&gt;
It is not for the sun to overtake the moon, nor doth the night outstrip the day. They float each in an orbit. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Biology==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Evolution===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an presupposes a [[creation|creationist]] view of life on earth. Its understanding of the history of human life is incompatible with the overwhelming scientific evidence that humans have evolved from prior life forms, over the course of millions of years, through natural selection [http://humanorigins.si.edu/evidence]. While some Muslims accept the theory of evolution, most reject it in favor of a creationist world view. [[Muslim Statistics - Science#Evolution|Opinion polls]] show that the majority of Muslims agree Islam and evolution are not compatible. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Human Creation from Clay====&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Creation of Humans from Clay}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur’an state that humans were created instantaneously from mud or clay. There is no indication that the author is aware of the evolution of human life over millions of years nor our common ancestry with apes and primates. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|15|26}}|&lt;br /&gt;
We created man from sounding clay, from mud molded into shape; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|117}}|&lt;br /&gt;
To Him is due the primal origin of the heavens and the earth: When He decreeth a matter, He saith to it: &amp;quot;Be,&amp;quot; and it is. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====First Humans: Adam and Eve====&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Qur&#039;an, Hadith and Scholars:Creation}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur’an and Hadith contains stories concerning the &#039;first humans&#039; and how all people are descended from these two earliest ancestors. It states that humans were created in a garden (paradise) and then brought to earth fully formed. This view of the origins of human life is clearly contradicted by the numerous fossils of pre-homosapien species that lived on earth for millions of years before modern humans first evolved.[http://humanorigins.si.edu/evidence]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|7|189}}|&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;He it is Who created you from a single being, and of the same (kind) did He make his mate,&amp;quot;  }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|4|55|548}}| Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah &#039;s Apostle said, &amp;quot;Treat women nicely, for &#039;&#039;&#039;a women is created from a rib&#039;&#039;&#039;, and the most curved portion of the rib is its upper portion, so, if you should try to straighten it, it will break, but if you leave it as it is, it will remain crooked. So treat women nicely.&amp;quot; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some Muslim apologists will claim the view of two ancestral “parents” is consistent with recent scientific findings that show a common female and male ancestor of all modern humans. They often exploit the confusion caused by scientists referring to these genetic ancestors as [[W:Mitochondrial Eve|Mitochondrial Eve]] and [[W:Y-chromosomal Adam|Y-chromosomal Adam]]. These two individuals bear little resemblance to the Quranic account as they are simply the last common male and female ancestors of everyone alive today, not of all humans in history. The Qur&#039;an clearly states Eve was created later than Adam, however [[W:Mitochondrial Eve|Mitochondrial Eve]] lived some 50,000 to 80,000 years earlier than [[W:Y-chromosomal Adam|Y-chromosomal Adam]].[http://biologos.org/blog/does-genetics-point-to-a-single-primal-couple]   Genetic evidence overwhelmingly indicates that humans diverged from earlier species as a population, not a single couple. [http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2011/09/18/how-big-was-the-human-population-bottleneck-not-anything-close-to-2/].&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Humans Created in Paradise and then Brought to Earth====&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Qur&#039;an, Hadith and Scholars:Creation}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an explicitly states that humans were first created outside of the earth and then only later sent down to live on the planet after being expelled from paradise. We have no evidence that humans ever lived in a terrestrial or extra-terrestrial paradise. In fact, all evidence points to primitive humanoids living in caves for tens of thousands of years before settling into more permanent dwellings. [http://www.historyworld.net/wrldhis/plaintexthistories.asp?historyid=ab27]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|36}}|&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;Then did Satan make them slip from the (garden), and get them out of the state (of felicity) in which they had been. We said: &#039;Get ye down, all (ye people), with enmity between yourselves. On &#039;&#039;&#039;earth will be your dwelling-place&#039;&#039;&#039; and your means of livelihood - for a time.&#039;   }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Muslim|4|1856}}| Abu Huraira reported Allah&#039;s Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: The best day on which the sun has risen is&#039;&#039;&#039; Friday; on it Adam was created&#039;&#039;&#039;, on it he was made to enter Paradise, on it he. was expelled from it.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Embryology===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Embryology in the Quran|l1=Embryology in the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an and Hadith contain statements about bodily fluids and the stages of development of the human embryo. Many of these descriptions are vague and unscientific. Most bare a striking resemblance to [[Greek and Jewish Ideas about Reproduction in the Quran and Hadith|similar descriptions]] found in the [[w:Talmud|Jewish Talmud]] and the ideas of ancient Greeks [[History of Embryology|such as Galen]], including their errors.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Sperm Originates Between the Backbone and Ribs====&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Quran and Semen Production|l1=Qur&#039;an and Semen Production}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an states, incorrectly, that semen originates from a spot between the backbone and ribs. Today we know sperm comes from the [[w:testicle|testicles]] and semen from the pelvic region, which is not between the spine and ribs.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|86|6|7}}|&lt;br /&gt;
He is created from a drop emitted- Proceeding from &#039;&#039;&#039;between the backbone and the ribs&#039;&#039;&#039; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Embryo is Formed from Male and Female Fluids====&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Greek and Jewish Ideas about Reproduction in the Quran and Hadith}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an describes the formation of a human embryo from fluids emanating from the man (and possibly also of the woman). This reflects the contemporary, but incorrect, view that the embryo is initially formed out of semen stored in the womb. In fact, semen is the vehicle for the sperm cells, one of which fuses with a woman&#039;s [[w:ovum|ovum]] in her [[w:fallopian tube|fallopian tube]], and the resulting cell divides and travels back into the womb for implantation. While English translations mention a &amp;quot;drop of seed&amp;quot;, or &amp;quot;drop of sperm&amp;quot;, the Arabic word in question literally means a small amount of liquid, a euphemism for semen.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|77|20|22}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Did We not create you from a &#039;&#039;&#039;liquid disdained&#039;&#039;&#039;? And We placed it in a firm lodging For a known extent.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|80|18|19}}|&lt;br /&gt;
From what thing doth He create him? From a &#039;&#039;&#039;drop of seed&#039;&#039;&#039;. He createth him and proportioneth him}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-wi|76|2}}|Verily We created Man from &#039;&#039;&#039;a drop of mingled sperm&#039;&#039;&#039; [nutfatin amshajin], in order to try him: So We gave him (the gifts), of Hearing and Sight.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====No Mention of Female Ovum====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an&#039;s author did not mention the role of the ovum in human reproduction and appears to have no knowledge of it. This verse fails to mention the important role of the female egg, or ovum, plays in the reproduction of humankind. It implies that reproduction is caused simply by the male semen. The human ovum is very small, though visible to the human eye, and it&#039;s purpose wasn&#039;t understood in the 7th century. Again, we are left wondering why an all-knowing deity would omit such information.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|25|45}}|He is created from a drop emitted}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Humans Created from a Clot of Blood====&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Embryology in Islamic Scripture}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an and Hadith depict that humans are formed from a clot of blood. There was never a stage in embryonic development where humans are formed into a clot of blood. This description is likely influenced by an unscientific and primitive understanding of human reproduction based on observations from an early-term miscarriage and a woman&#039;s menstrual cycle.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|96|2}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Created man, out of a (mere) clot of congealed blood: }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Bukhari|4|54|430}}|Narrated &#039;Abdullah bin Mus&#039;ud: &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
“Allah&#039;s Apostle, the true and truly inspired said, &amp;quot;(The matter of the Creation of) a human being is put together in the womb of the mother in forty days, and then he becomes a &#039;&#039;&#039;clot of thick blood for a similar period&#039;&#039;&#039;, and then a piece of flesh for a similar period.”}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Only Allah Knows the Gender of a Fetus====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Current technology, such as [[w:Medical ultrasonography|sonograms]], has enabled doctors and expecting parents to learn the gender of a baby while still in the womb. There are also [[w:sex selection|sex selection]] techniques and clinics that allow a couple to predetermine the sex of their child.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|31|34}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Verily the knowledge of the Hour &#039;&#039;&#039;is with Allah (alone)&#039;&#039;&#039;. It is He Who sends down rain, and He Who knows what is in the wombs. Nor does any one know what it is that he will earn on the morrow: Nor does any one know in what land he is to die. Verily with Allah is full knowledge and He is acquainted (with all things). }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===All Organisms are Created in Pairs===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Quranic Claim of Everything Created in Pairs|l1=Qur&#039;anic Claim of Everything Created in Pairs}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Not every creature procreates or reproduces through male and female sexual relationship. The [[w:Desert grassland whiptail lizard|whiptail lizard]] in the U.S. Southwest, Mexico, and South America, is an all-females species which reproduces by [[w:parthenogenesis|parthenogenesis]]. [[w:virus|Viruses]] reproduce using a host&#039;s DNA and are neither female nor male. [[w:Bacteria|Bacteria]] reproduce by cell division. [[w:Fungus|Fungus]] can reproduce either sexually or asexually. Many species of plants also reproduce either asexually or through [[w:Pollination|pollination]]. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|51|49}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And of &#039;&#039;&#039;every thing&#039;&#039;&#039; We have created pairs: That ye may receive instruction. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Womb has Three Layers===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Greek and Jewish Ideas about Reproduction in the Quran and Hadith|l1=Greek and Jewish Ideas about Reproduction in the Qur&#039;an and Hadith}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The word [http://www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume1/00000257.pdf butun] (بطن) means belly/abdomen/midriff, though some translators like to use the more specific word &amp;quot;womb&amp;quot;. There are many more layers in the human body such as the endometrium, myometrium, perimetrium, peritoneum, besides the cervix uteri, corpus uteri, abdomen (with walls), and placenta (with layers). The idea of three membranes around the fetus (chorion, allantois, and amnion) was taught by the highly influential Greek physician, Galen. It is likely that the Quranic author is simply repeating this erroneous idea.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|39|6}}|&lt;br /&gt;
He created you (all) from a single person: then created, of like nature, his mate; and he sent down for you eight head of cattle in pairs: He makes you, in the wombs of your mothers, in stages, one after another, in &#039;&#039;&#039;three veils of darkness&#039;&#039;&#039;. such is Allah, your Lord and Cherisher: to Him belongs (all) dominion. There is no god but He: then how are ye turned away (from your true Centre)? }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Bones are Formed before Flesh===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Embryology in the Quran|l1=Embryology in the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an explains that the bones of a human embryo are formed first and then covered up with flesh. Modern scientific studies and research have shown that the bones and muscles of a developing fetus are formed simultaneously. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|23|14}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Then We made the sperm into a clot of congealed blood; then of that clot We made a (foetus) lump; then we made out of that lump bones then (not and) clothed the bones with flesh; then we developed out of it another creature. So blessed be Allah, the best to create! }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Source and Purity of Milk===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Qur&#039;an and Milk}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an states that milk is produced, in the body, somewhere between excretions and blood. The mammary glands, where milk is produced and stored, are nowhere near the intestines which is where excrement is stored. Many kinds of cattle and goat milk needs processing or pasteurization before they can safely be consumed; the milk is often infected with bacteria and other micro-organisms. A significant number of  humans are [[Qur&#039;an and Milk|lactose intolerant]] and unable to digest milk without experiencing abdominal bloating and cramps, flatulence, diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting. This makes the Qur&#039;anic claim that milk is &#039;pure&#039; and &#039;agreeable&#039; to those who drink it dubious.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|66}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And verily in cattle (too) will ye find an instructive sign. From what is within their bodies &#039;&#039;&#039;between excretions and blood&#039;&#039;&#039;, We produce, for your drink, milk, &#039;&#039;&#039;pure and agreeable&#039;&#039;&#039; to those who drink it. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Corn has Seven Ears, Each with a Hundred Grains===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A corn plant generally has only one or two ears and an ear has up to 600 grains.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|261}}|&lt;br /&gt;
The parable of those who spend their substance in the way of Allah is that of a grain of corn: it groweth seven ears, and each ear Hath a hundred grains. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Geology and Meteorology==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===The Earth is Flat===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Flat Earth and the Quran|l1=Flat Earth and the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Facing Toward Mecca====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an tells all Muslims to face in the direction of Mecca when they pray. However, this would only be possible on a flat Earth because it is not possible to bow down towards the direction of Mecca when you are on the opposite side of the earth. The author here presupposes a small world, local to Arabia, that is flat. Only in that world view can people everywhere face Mecca. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|149}}|&lt;br /&gt;
From whencesoever Thou startest forth, turn Thy face in the direction of the sacred Mosque; that is indeed the truth from the Lord. And Allah is not unmindful of what ye do.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Earth is Spread Out and Flat====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an mentions to his audience that the earth is &#039;spread out&#039; and layed flat like a carpet spread on the ground. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|88|20}}|And at the Earth, how it is spread out?}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;anic commentator al-Jalalayn in his Tasfir agrees with this understanding of the verse saying that most scholars at his time agree that the earth is flat and not spherical.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Tafsir al-Jalalayn |And the earth, how it was laid out flat?, and thus infer from this the power of God, exalted be He, and His Oneness? The commencing with the [mention of] camels is because they are closer in contact with it [the earth] than any other [animal]. As for His words sutihat, &#039;laid out flat&#039;, this on a literal reading suggests &#039;&#039;&#039;that the earth is flat, which is the opinion of most of the scholars&#039;&#039;&#039; of the [revealed] Law, and &#039;&#039;&#039;not a sphere as astronomers (ahl al-hay&#039;a) have it&#039;&#039;&#039;, even if this [latter] does not contradict any of the pillars of the Law.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Earth is Like a Couch====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The earth is described as a couch, flat and laid out for people to lay upon.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|22}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Who has made the earth your couch, and the heavens your dome; and sent down rain from the heavens; and brought forth therewith Fruits for your sustenance; then set not up rivals unto Allah when ye know (the truth). }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ibn-Kathir in his Tafsir agrees with this interpretation that the earth is flat and comfortable like a bed.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Ibn-Kathir |who has made the earth as flat and comfortable as a bed and placed upon it mountains standing firm... (Tafsir Ibn Kathir (Part 1) }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Earth is Like a Carpet====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The earth is described like a carpet, completely flat and spread out on the ground and not rolled up for storage. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|20|53}}|&lt;br /&gt;
He Who has, made for you &#039;&#039;&#039;the earth like a carpet spread out&#039;&#039;&#039;; has enabled you to go about therein by roads (and channels); }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|43|10}}|&lt;br /&gt;
He Who has, made for you &#039;&#039;&#039;the earth like a carpet spread out&#039;&#039;&#039;; has enabled you to go about therein by roads (and channels); and has sent down water from the sky.&amp;quot; With it have We produced diverse pairs of plants each separate from the others. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Earth is a Wide Plain====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an sees the earth as a wide plain or expanse. This is often likened to a flat bed, as some translators put it. Again, the author seems unaware of the curvature of the earth or the fact that it is a sphere.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|78|6}}|Have We not made the earth as a wide expanse, }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
====Earth is Level====&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an describes a time in the future when mountains will be removed leaving the earth smooth and level. This description assumes the earth is already flat and level with only the mountains giving it shape. The author here appears to have no knowledge that the earth is curved and not level.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|18|47}}|One Day We shall remove the mountains, and thou wilt see &#039;&#039;&#039;the earth as a level stretch&#039;&#039;&#039;, and We shall gather them, all together, nor shall We leave out any one of them.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|20|105}}|They ask thee concerning the Mountains: say &amp;quot;My Lord will uproot them and scatter them as dust; He will &#039;&#039;&#039;leave them as plains smooth and level&#039;&#039;&#039;; Nothing crooked or curved wilt thou see in their place}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Earth has Seven Atmospheric Layers===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Science and the Seven Earths}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some apologists believe the Qur&#039;an describes the layers of the earth&#039;s atmosphere when it refers to the firmament and it&#039;s likeness on earth. However, scientists have determined that there are [[w:Atmosphere_of_Earth#Structure_of_the_atmosphere|five principal layers]] in the atmosphere and not seven.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|65|12}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Allah is He Who Created &#039;&#039;&#039;seven&#039;&#039;&#039; firmaments and &#039;&#039;&#039;of the earth a similar number&#039;&#039;&#039;. Through the midst of them (all) descends His command: that ye may know that Allah has power over all things, and that Allah comprehends all things In (His) Knowledge.)&amp;quot; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===The Earth does not Rotate===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an repeats a common view of the 7&amp;lt;sup&amp;gt;th&amp;lt;/sup&amp;gt; century that the earth was a fixed and un-moving object with the stars, sun, and moon revolving around it. The author appears to be unaware that the earth is rotating around its axis and moving through space around the sun.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|27|61}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Is not He (better than your gods) Who has made the earth as &#039;&#039;&#039;a fixed abode&#039;&#039;&#039;, and has placed rivers in its midst, and has placed firm mountains therein, and has set a barrier between the two seas (of salt and sweet water). Is there any ilah (god) with Allah? Nay, but most of them know not.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://www.qtafsir.com/index.php?option=com_content&amp;amp;task=view&amp;amp;id=2232&amp;amp;Itemid=83 The Command to praise Allah and send Blessings on His Messengers]&amp;lt;BR&amp;gt;Tafsir Ibn Kathir|2=(Is not He Who has made the earth as a fixed abode,) meaning, &#039;&#039;&#039;stable and stationary, so that it does not move or convulse&#039;&#039;&#039;, because if it were to do so, it would not be a good place for people to live on. But by His grace and mercy, He has made it smooth and calm, and it is not shaken or moved}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Permanent Barrier between Fresh and Salt Water===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Meeting of Fresh and Salt Water in the Quran}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
When a fresh water river flows into the sea or ocean, there is a transition region in between. This transition region is called an [[w:estuary|estuary]] where the fresh water remains temporarily separated from the salt water. However, this separation is not absolute (thus cannot be described as a &amp;quot;barrier&amp;quot;), is not permanent, and the different salinity levels between the two bodies of water eventually homogenize. The Qur&#039;an however erroneously says that the seperation between the two types of water is absolute and permanent. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|25|53}}| It is He Who has let free the two bodies of flowing water: One palatable and sweet, and the other salt and bitter; yet has He made a barrier between them, &#039;&#039;&#039;a partition that is forbidden to be passed&#039;&#039;&#039;. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Mountains Prevent Earthquakes===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|The Quran and Mountains|l1=The Qur&#039;an and Mountains}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Modern geology has discovered that large plates in the crust of the earth are responsible for the formation of mountains. Called [[w:Plate tectonics|Plate tectonic]] these massive plates meet and the pressure between them pushes up the crust forming mountains but also causing earthquakes and faults. the Qur&#039;an propagates the idea that mountains are crucial in stabilizing the earth when, in fact, the earth would be much more stable and have less earthquakes if mountains did not exist.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|15}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And He has set up on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with you; and rivers and roads; that ye may guide yourselves}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Mountains Cast into the Earth===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Mountains are usually formed through the movement of lithosphere plates. They were not thrown down into the earth.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|15}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And He hath cast into the earth firm hills that it quake not with you, and streams and roads that ye may find a way }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Chest Contracts with Altitude===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Quran Describes Altitude Sickness|l1=Qur&#039;an Describes Altitude Sickness}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This verse says that your chest cavity gets smaller with higher altitude when in reality the opposite is true.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|6|125}}|Those whom Allah (in His plan) willeth to guide,- He openeth their breast to Islam; those whom He willeth to leave straying,- He maketh their breast close and constricted, as if they had to climb up to the skies: thus doth Allah (heap) the penalty on those who refuse to believe.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Earthquakes are a Punishment from God===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Accidents and Natural Disasters in the Muslim World}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some of the highest death tolls from natural disasters in the last decade were in Muslim countries. In fact, natural disasters do not differentiate between Muslim or non-Muslim nations nor are they controlled by a divine being. Earth quakes are extremely common along tectonic fault lines and are not a punishment for human behavior but the byproduct of natural forces. The Qur&#039;anic author perpetuates an unscientific understanding of his phenomena in there verses.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|45}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Do then those who devise evil (plots) feel secure that Allah will not cause the earth to swallow them up, or that the Wrath will not seize them from directions they little perceive?}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|29|37}}|&lt;br /&gt;
But they denied him, and the dreadful earthquake took them, and morning found them prostrate in their dwelling place. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Hurricanes and Blizzards are a Punishment from God===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Accidents and Natural Disasters in the Muslim World}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Two of the deadliest blizzards in history happened in Muslim countries. However, the Qur&#039;an regards those natural disasters as violent punishment from God. Weather patterns follow predictable patterns and are not controlled by a divine being. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|17|68}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Do ye then feel secure that He will not cause you to be swallowed up beneath the earth when ye are on land, or that He will not send against you a violent tornado (with showers of stones) so that ye shall find no one to carry out your affairs for you}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Rainwater is Pure===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an says rainwater is pure, though in some industrial areas rainwater can contain significant amounts of pollution and acidity. Called [[w:Acid Rain|acid rain]] this type of rain causes harmful effects on plants, aquatic animals and buildings.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|25|48}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And He it is Who sends the winds as good news before His mercy; and We send down pure water from the cloud, }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Rain has Miraculous Effects===&lt;br /&gt;
Rain does not have the effects on humans which the Qur&#039;an claims, like cleaning the stains of Satan or strengthening the heart.&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|8|11}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Remember He covered you with a sort of drowsiness, to give you calm as from Himself, and he caused rain to descend on you from heaven, to clean you therewith, to remove from you the stain of Satan, to strengthen your hearts, and to plant your feet firmly therewith. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===No Evaporation in Water Cycle===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Responses_to_Zakir_Naik#Water_Cycle_in_the_Qur.27an|l1=Water Cycle in the Qur&#039;an}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Every verse about rain in the Qur&#039;an implies that rain comes either directly from the sky or from Allah. However evaporation of water into the air is conspicuously never mentioned.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|43|11}}|&lt;br /&gt;
That sends down (from time to time) rain from the sky in due measure;- and We raise to life therewith a land that is dead; even so will ye be raised (from the dead)}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Hail Comes from Mountains in the Sky===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Hail forms in cumulonimbus clouds when super-cooled water droplets freeze. However, the Qur&#039;an mistakenly ascribed the formation of hail to invisible mountains in the sky.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|24|43}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Seest thou not that Allah makes the clouds move gently, then joins them together, then makes them into a heap? - then wilt thou see rain issue forth from their midst. And &#039;&#039;&#039;He sends down from the sky mountain masses (of clouds) wherein is hail&#039;&#039;&#039;. He strikes therewith whom He pleases and He turns it away from whom He pleases, the vivid flash of His lightning well-nigh blinds the sight. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Thunder is an Angel===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;anic author was superstitious about thunder and imagined this natural phenomena as an angel.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|13|13}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And the thunder declares His glory with His praise, and the angels too for awe of Him; and He sends the thunderbolts and smites with them whom He pleases, yet they dispute concerning Allah, and He is mighty in prowess.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Muslim sources, which explain this verse clearly, indicate that the author of the Qur&#039;an believed that thunder was not an impersonal natural phenomenon, but an angel:&lt;br /&gt;
 &lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|1=[http://altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=2&amp;amp;tTafsirNo=73&amp;amp;tSoraNo=13&amp;amp;tAyahNo=13&amp;amp;tDisplay=yes&amp;amp;UserProfile=0 Tafsir Ibn-Abbas]|2=(The thunder hymneth His praise) by His command; &#039;&#039;&#039;it is an angel&#039;&#039;&#039;; it is also said: it is the voice of the sky (and (so do) the angels) and also the angels hymn His praise (for awe of Him) the angels have awe towards Allah. (He launcheth the thunder bolts) i.e. fire (and smiteth with them whom He will) He destroys by means of fire whoever He will, referring here to Zayd Ibn Qays whom Allah destroyed by fire, along with his friend ‘Amir Ibn al-Tufayl who was killed as a result of being stabbed in his waist (while they dispute (in doubt) concerning Allah) while they dispute with Muhammad (pbuh) concerning the Religion of Allah, (and He is mighty in wrath) His chastisement is severe }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Zoology==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Bees Eat Fruit===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Bees feed on nectar and pollen. However, the Qur&#039;an relates that bees consume fruit.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|68-69}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And thy Lord taught the Bee to build its cells in hills, on trees, and in (men&#039;s) habitations;  &#039;&#039;&#039;Then to eat of all the fruits (of the earth)&#039;&#039;&#039;, and find with skill the spacious paths of its Lord: there issues from within their bodies a drink of varying colors, wherein is healing for men: verily in this is a Sign for those who give thought. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Ants Recognize Humans and Speak with Each Other===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ants typically communicate with each other using pheromone which are a chemical signal. While scientists have also discovered that ants make some noises, nothing has ever indicated that the brains of ants could produce such complex communication as is depicted in the Quranic story of Solomon and the ants. However, the Qur&#039;an tells us that not only does an ant warn his fellow ants of the approach of a large army of humans, but it recognizes one of the humans as Solomon. How an ant could even see that far or have known the identify of Solomon is never explained. This account of a talking ant is clearly a legend and not scientific.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|27|18}}|&lt;br /&gt;
At length, when they came to a (lowly) valley of ants, one of the ants said: &amp;quot;O ye ants, get into your habitations, lest Solomon and his hosts crush you (under foot) without knowing it.&amp;quot; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Horses Created as Transportation===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
It took thousands of years of domestication and cross-breeding before horses were domesticated approximately 4,000 years ago in East Europe and Central Asia. Prior to this, horses were wild animals though the Qur&#039;an neglects to mention this important fact. Even today [[w:Feral horse|feral horses]] are descendants of once domesticated horses that aren&#039;t tamed or used for human transportation. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|8}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And (He has created) horses, mules, and donkeys, for you to ride and use for show; and He has created (other) things of which ye have no knowledge.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Bird Flight is a Miracle===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Today, engineers and scientists are well aware of the aerodynamic properties of a bird&#039;s wing. It functions by creating a difference in the air pressure between the lower and upper part of the wing and this creates lift that pushes the bird upward. The wings of birds evolved over millions of years to acquire this feature. The author of the Qur&#039;an, however, is unaware of these scientific details and says that &#039;nothing&#039; holds up the bird except the miraculous power of Allah.&lt;br /&gt;
  &lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|16|79}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Do they not look at the birds, held poised in the midst of (the air and) the sky? Nothing holds them up but (the power of) Allah. Verily in this are signs for those who believe}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Classification of Creatures===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an observes that creatures of the desert move using their bellies (snake) or two legs (human) or four legs (cows, goats, etc.). However, the author fails to include insects such as millipedes that have a thousand legs.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|24|45}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And Allah has created &#039;&#039;&#039;every&#039;&#039;&#039; animal from water: of them there are some that creep on their bellies; some that walk on two legs; and some that walk on four. Allah creates what He wills for verily Allah has power over all things. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Only Eight Types of Cattle===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
While the Qur&#039;an states that there are eight kinds of cattle, In fact there are more than a dozen kinds of cattle. The word &amp;quot;cattle&amp;quot; in 39:6 is [http://www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume8/00000289.pdf al-ana&#039;ami], meaning pasturing (i.e. grazing) animals. The word [http://www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume3/00000432.pdf azwajin] (&amp;quot;kinds&amp;quot; in the translation of 39:6 below) generally means mate or member of a pair. {{Quran|6|143-144}} clarifies that these refer to male and female pairs of sheep, goats, oxes and camels. This neglects other types of cattle from the regions outside of Arabia such as reindeer, which are important to people in northern latitudes. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|39|6}}|&lt;br /&gt;
He created you from one being, then from that (being) He made its mate; and He hath provided for you of &#039;&#039;&#039;cattle eight kinds&#039;&#039;&#039;. He created you in the wombs of your mothers, creation after creation, in a threefold gloom. Such is Allah, your Lord. His is the Sovereignty. There is no Allah save Him. How then are ye turned away}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Birth Defects and Imperfections===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an states that there are no flaws in anything. The author fails to mention the numerous defects and imperfections in all species.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|67|3}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Who hath created seven heavens in harmony. Thou (Muhammad) canst see no fault in the Beneficent One&#039;s creation; then look again: Canst thou see any flaw?}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Poisonous Sea Life is Edible===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A number of sea creatures are deadly and fatal to humans if consumed. This includes the [[w:puffer fish|puffer fish]], [[w:poison dart frog|poison dart frong]], marbled cone snail, [[w:blue ringed octopus|blue ringed octopus]] and [[w:stonefish|stonefish]]. The Qur&#039;an, however, makes no prohibition against eating these types of animals even though it goes into lengthy detail forbidding the consumption of pigs, which are safe for humans to eat. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|5|96}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Lawful to you is the pursuit of water-game and its use for food,- for the benefit of yourselves and those who travel; but forbidden is the pursuit of land-game;- as long as ye are in the sacred precincts or in pilgrim garb. And fear Allah, to Whom ye shall be gathered back. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Birds Fight Elephants===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Birds and elephants don&#039;t fight each other. In fact, African elephants and birds have a symbiotic relationship where the birds eat bugs and lice off of elephants  [http://www.elephant-facts.co.uk/relationship-between-african-elephants-and-birds/]. The Qur&#039;an here depicts a fanciful story of birds being directed to attack elephants and their riders during a battle.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|105|1|3}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Sees thou not how Allah dealt with the companions of the elephants? Did He not make their plan into misguidance? And he sent against them flights of birds. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sinful Animals===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
According to the Qur&#039;an, all animals will be judged for their sins. This despite the fact that animals are not as self-aware as humans and operate almost exclusively on instinct.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|6|38}}|&lt;br /&gt;
There is not an animal (that lives) on the earth, nor a being that flies on its wings, but (forms part of) communities like you. Nothing have we omitted from the Book, and they (all) shall be gathered to their Lord in the end. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==History==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Wall of Iron between Two Mountains===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Dhul-Qarnayn}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The author of the Qur&#039;an repeats the Syrian legend of Alexander the Great as a great king who helps a tribe of people build a massive wall of iron between two mountains. Even with satellites and near universal exploration of the world, no archaeologist has ever found even a trace of such a massive structure.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran-range|18|96|97}}|&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;Bring me blocks of iron.&amp;quot; At length, when he had &#039;&#039;&#039;filled up the space between the two steep mountain-sides&#039;&#039;&#039;, He said, &amp;quot;Blow (with your bellows)&amp;quot; Then, when he had made it (red) as fire, he said: &amp;quot;Bring me, that I may pour over it, molten lead.&amp;quot; Thus were they made powerless to scale it or to dig through it.&lt;br /&gt;
}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Christians Worship Mary as Part of the Trinity===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Christians have never worshiped Mary as part of the Trinity. The author of the Qur&#039;an seems to be mistaken in his understanding of the doctrine of the Trinity and the theology of Christians throughout history. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|5|116}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And behold! Allah will say: &amp;quot;O Jesus the son of Mary! Didst thou say unto men, worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of Allah&#039;?&amp;quot; He will say: &amp;quot;Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart, Thou I know not what is in Thine. For Thou knowest in full all that is hidden}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Mary Confused with Miriam ===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Each of the following verses narrates the story of Jesus&#039;s birth. But Mary the mother of Jesus was born in the first century BCE and is not related to Moses and his family that existed 1500 years before. Miriam, not Mary, was the sister of Moses and Aaron and daughter of Amram (Imran).&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|19|27-28}}|At length she brought the (babe) to her people, carrying him (in her arms). They said: &amp;quot;O Mary! truly an amazing thing hast thou brought! &#039;&#039;&#039;O sister of Aaron!&#039;&#039;&#039; Thy father was not a man of evil, nor thy mother a woman unchaste!&amp;quot; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|66|12}}|And &#039;&#039;&#039;Mary, the daughter of &#039;Imran&#039;&#039;&#039;, who guarded her chastity; and We breathed into (her body) of Our spirit; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Hence the claim that Mary&#039;s mother is the wife of Imran is also false.&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|3|35-36}}| Behold! &#039;&#039;&#039;a woman of &#039;Imran&#039;&#039;&#039; said: &amp;quot;O my Lord! I do dedicate unto Thee what is in my womb for Thy special service: So accept this of me: For Thou hearest and knowest all things.&amp;quot; When she was delivered, she said: &amp;quot;O my Lord! Behold! I am delivered of a female child!&amp;quot;- and Allah knew best what she brought forth- &amp;quot;And no wise is the male Like the female. I have named her Mary, and I commend her and her offspring to Thy protection from the Evil One, the Rejected.&amp;quot; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Noah&#039;s Ark holds Every Species===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The legend of Noah and the Ark states that two of each kind of animal was placed on an ark. However, there are over a hundred thousand species of animals including penguins, polar bears, koala bears, and kangaroos that live spread across the entire planet and in different climates and requiring specialized diets. There is no way such an event could have occurred.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|11|40}}|&lt;br /&gt;
At length, behold! there came Our command, and the fountains of the earth gushed forth! We said: &amp;quot;Embark therein, of each kind two, male and female, and your family - except those against whom the word has already gone forth,- and the Believers.&amp;quot; but only a few believed with him. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Pharaoh or Pharaohs===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Geographically, the Coptic land of Egypt was adjacent to Arabia. Thus, most Arabs were aware of the preservation method applied by the ancient Egyptian to their Pharaohs. There were so many Pharaohs ranging from numerous dynasties, many of them were preserved intact. But the Qur&#039;an merely narrated one Pharaoh that was preserved.&lt;br /&gt;
 &lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|10|92}}|&lt;br /&gt;
This day shall We save thee in the body, that thou mayest be a sign to those who come after thee! but verily, many among mankind are heedless of Our Signs!&amp;quot; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Jews call Ezra the Son of God===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Historically, Judaism has been a strict form of monotheism. But the author of the Qur&#039;an accuses Jews of polytheism by stating that they call Uzair (Ezra) the son of God in the same way that Christians see Jesus as the son of God. The author of the Qur&#039;an seems to be unaware of the different theological implications of these two terms between Judaism and Christianity.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|9|30}}|&lt;br /&gt;
The Jews call &#039;Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah&#039;s curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth! }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Supernatural Destruction of Cities===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an author thought that outside the vicinity of Arabia there were cities and tribes destroyed by Allah. He acquired this information through hearsay from Arabian folklore as well as other legends. Those cities and tribes probably were destroyed by natural disasters, famine, wars, migration or neglect. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|40|82}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Do they not travel through the earth and see what was the End of those before them? They were more numerous than these and superior in strength and in the traces (they have left) in the land: Yet all that they accomplished was of no profit to them. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Humans can Sleep for Three Hundred Years===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The oldest verified human life has been a little over 120 years. Humans cannot live without food and water for more than a few days. However, the Qur&#039;an incorporated a myth from the 5&amp;lt;sup&amp;gt;th&amp;lt;/sup&amp;gt; century legends of the [[Seven Sleepers of Ephesus in the Quran|Seven Sleepers of Ephesus]] who sleep in a cave for over 300 years and then miraculously awaken in perfect health. There is no historical evidence that this ever happened or could even been scientifically possible.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|18|11}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Then We sealed up their hearing in the Cave for a number of years. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Humans can Live for a Thousand Years===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The oldest verified human life has been a little over 120 years. Based on fossil records and testing on human remains, anthropologists have concluded that human life spans are increasing, not decreasing. Nevertheless, the Qur&#039;an claims that Noah lived for almost 1,000 years.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|29|14}}|&lt;br /&gt;
We (once) sent Noah to his people, and he tarried among them &#039;&#039;&#039;a thousand years less fifty&#039;&#039;&#039;: but the Deluge overwhelmed them while they (persisted in) sin. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Non-Existent Mosque in Jerusalem===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Muslims claim that Al-Aqsa mosque is mentioned in the Qur&#039;an as the furthest mosque, even though there was obviously no mosque in Jerusalem during Muhammad&#039;s time.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|17|1}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Glory to (Allah) Who did take His servant for a Journey by night from the Sacred Mosque to the farthest Mosque, whose precincts We did bless,- in order that We might show him some of Our Signs: for He is the One Who heareth and seeth (all things). }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Sociology==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Fasting and Prayer Requirements at the Poles===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|The Ramadan Pole Paradox}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Muhammad was apparently unfamiliar with polar regions in which there are six months without sunlight and six months perpetual night during winter and summer. The Qur&#039;an claims that Muslims should fast from sunrise till sunset, however this is arguably not observable by anyone living in the polar regions. &lt;br /&gt;
 &lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|187}}|&lt;br /&gt;
...then complete your fast Till the night appears;...}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A similar issue exists for the five daily prayers. Anyone living in the polar region would not be able to make a sunset or sunrise prayer all year round. Even for cities further south like Aberdeen in Scotland, the gap between the night prayer (Isha) and the dawn prayer (Fajr) is around 4 and a half hours in June, so anyone following these rules has to interupt their sleep around 3.20am, then go back to sleep before getting up for the day. Such issues would not have crossed the mind of a 7th century man in Arabia, who believed that everyone experiences sunrise and sunset when he does, and where it would be perfectly natural to arise at dawn any time of the year.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|17|78}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Establish regular prayers - at the sun&#039;s decline till the darkness of the night, and the morning prayer and reading: for the prayer and reading in the morning carry their testimony.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===People are Protected in Mecca===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Hajj}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an claims Allah has made Mecca and the Ka&#039;aba a place of safety. However, historically it has been attacked and seen battles numerous times. Juhayman al-Otaybi, Abd-Allah ibn al-Zubayr, and Abu Tahir al-Janabi killed thousands of Muslim pilgrims in Mecca. Moreover, Yazid Bin Muawiya sent an army battalion to attack Mecca and desecrated the Ka&#039;aba. The universal safety of people in Mecca has no historical evidence supporting it.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|125}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Remember We made the House a place of assembly for men and &#039;&#039;&#039;a place of safety&#039;&#039;&#039;; and take ye the station of Abraham as a place of prayer; and We covenanted with Abraham and Isma&#039;il, that they should sanctify My House for those who compass it round, or use it as a retreat, or bow, or prostrate themselves (therein in prayer). }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|5|97}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Allah made &#039;&#039;&#039;the Ka&#039;ba, the Sacred House, an asylum of security for men&#039;&#039;&#039;, as also the Sacred Months, the animals for offerings, and the garlands that mark them: That ye may know that Allah hath knowledge of what is in the heavens and on earth and that Allah is well acquainted with all things. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===All Animals Live in Communities===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Some animals such as the jaguar, leopard, and panda are well known for being solitary creatures, rarely meeting in pairs and only to mate. They do not live in communities and routinely fight each other over territory.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|6|38}}|&lt;br /&gt;
There is not an animal (that lives) on the earth, nor a being that flies on its wings, &#039;&#039;&#039;but (forms part of) communities like you&#039;&#039;&#039;. Nothing have we omitted from the Book, and they (all) shall be gathered to their Lord in the end. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Requirement to Learn in Arabic===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
There are over 5,000 languages and dialects in the world, with less than 4% of the world&#039;s population being native Arabic speakers. However, it is incumbent upon Muslims to pray in Arabic, recite the Qur&#039;an in Arabic, and understand commentaries and the traditions of Muhammad in Arabic. We are left wondering why an all-knowing being would not provide a more efficient way to send his message to all people on earth and why he does not account for the immense diversity of languages.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|43|3}}|&lt;br /&gt;
We have made it a Qur&#039;an in Arabic, that ye may be able to understand (and learn wisdom). }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Non-Muslims are Deaf, Dumb, and Blind===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Golden Age}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an calls non-believers &amp;quot;deaf dumb and blind&amp;quot;. However all the technology, medicine, and scientific advancements in the Muslim world are almost exclusively purchased from the non-Muslim countries. Computers, television, space travel, helicopters, media players, nuclear bombs, cameras, satellites, birth control pills, vaccinations, telephones, radios, light bulbs, microchips, games consoles, refrigerators, microwaves, plastic, aluminium, x-rays, antibiotics, heart-transplants, the internet etc., were all invented by non-Muslims.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|18}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Deaf, dumb, and blind, they will not return (to the path)}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Myths and Legendary Tales==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Humans Transformed into Apes===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an records a miraculous event where Sabbath breakers are transformed into apes. This account seems to be a mere legend and has no basis in scientific fact.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|65}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And well ye knew those amongst you who transgressed in the matter of the Sabbath: We said to them: &amp;quot;Be ye apes, despised and rejected.&amp;quot; }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
=== Golden Calf Statue Moos ===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A statue of a calf was cast out of ornaments but it could moo.&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|20|88}}|So he brought forth for them a calf, a (mere) body, which had a mooing sound, so they said: This is your god and the god of Musa, but he forgot.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Tribe Trapped Behind a Wall===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Dhul-Qarnayn}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The story of Dhul-Qarnayn says that a tribe is trapped behind a massive wall of Iron. According to the Qur&#039;an, these two beast tribes concealed themselves behind this metal wall and will only be let free on the day of Judgement. Obviously, no such wall has ever been found nor is there a tribe somewhere on earth trapped behind it.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|21|96}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Until the Gog and Magog (people) are let through (their barrier), and they swiftly swarm from every hill. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Supernatural Food===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Parallelism Between the Qur&#039;an and Judeo-Christian Scriptures}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an states Mary received food sent down from heaven. There have never been any scientifically verified accounts of fully cooked food falling from the sky.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|5|115}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Jesus, son of Mary, said: O Allah, Lord of us! &#039;&#039;&#039;Send down for us a table spread with food from heaven, that it may be a feast for us&#039;&#039;&#039;, for the first of us and for the last of us, and a sign from Thee. Give us sustenance, for Thou art the Best of Sustainers.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===A Stick Transforms into a Serpent===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Parallelism Between the Qur&#039;an and Judeo-Christian Scriptures}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|7|107}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Then (Moses) threw his rod, and behold! it was a serpent, plain (for all to see)! }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Solomon&#039;s Army of Genies and Birds===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Throughout history, kings and emperors had commanded huge and small amount of armies. None was ever recorded to possess armies that entirely consists of birds and genies. This story in the Qur&#039;an draws on Jewish folklore.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|27|16-17}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And Solomon was David&#039;s heir. He said: &amp;quot;O ye people! We have been taught the speech of birds, and on us has been bestowed (a little) of all things: this is indeed Grace manifest (from Allah.)And before Solomon were marshalled his hosts― of Jinns and men and birds, and they were all kept in order and ranks.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
He spoke with a [[w:Hoopoe|Hoopoe]] bird and wanted to punish it for a small error.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|27|20-22}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And he took a muster of the Birds; and he said: &amp;quot;Why is it I see not the Hoopoe? Or is he among the absentees? I will certainly punish him with a severe Penalty, or execute him, unless he bring me a clear reason (for absence).}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Hoopoe bird was in fact busy eavesdropping on a beautiful female ruler, Queen Sheba.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|27|23}}|&lt;br /&gt;
I found (there) a woman ruling over them and provided with every requisite; and she has a magnificent throne.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Jonah Performs Repentance inside a Fish===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A human could not live inside a fish and pray. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|37|142}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Then the big Fish did swallow him, and he had done acts worthy of blame. Had it not been that he (repented and) glorified Allah,He would certainly have remained inside the Fish till the Day of Resurrection.But We cast him forth, on the naked shore in a state of sickness}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Muhammad Flies on a Winged Horse to Heaven===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Buraq}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
It took one week to travel from Mecca to the Farthest Mosque by camel. But the Qur&#039;an reveals that a magical winged horse, called the Buraq, traveled a similar distance in a matter of minutes. No such creature has ever been shown to be real and it seems to only exist in legend and mythology.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|17|1}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Glory to (Allah) Who did take His servant for a Journey by night from the Sacred Mosque to the farthest Mosque, whose precincts We did bless,- in order that We might show him some of Our Signs: for He is the One Who heareth and seeth (all things). }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Body Parts Speak===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The limbs and organs of a human are controlled by the brain that conveys electrical signal through the nervous system. But the Qur&#039;an believes that the limbs can talk and testify against the person, even though they would have no voice, memory or mind of their own.&lt;br /&gt;
 &lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|24|24}}|&lt;br /&gt;
On the Day when their tongues, their hands, and their feet will bear witness against them as to their actions. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===The Ocean Split in Half===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Moses and the Israelites crossed an ocean that was split into two halves. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|50}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And remember &#039;&#039;&#039;We divided the sea for you&#039;&#039;&#039; and saved you and drowned Pharaoh&#039;s people within your very sight. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Solomon can Control the Wind===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
King Solomon had the authority to manipulate the wind at his command and could fly anywhere he wanted.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|38|36}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Then We subjected the wind to his power, to flow gently to his order, Whithersoever he willed  }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|Ibn-Kathir | A flying carpet made from wood, on top of which he could carry everything in his kingdom including chairs, to wherever Solomon wants to go, whilst flocks of birds would fly over to give shade }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===A Dead Man Testified against his Killer===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Scientifically, a man who has died for a few days can never be resurrected. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|2|72}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And We said: Smite him with some of it. Thus Allah bringeth the dead to life and showeth you His portents so that ye may understand. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Animals Speak to Humans===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The Qur&#039;an states that a beast will come and tell humans the truth.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|27|82}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And when the Word is fulfilled against them (the unjust), we shall produce from the &#039;&#039;&#039;earth a beast&#039;&#039;&#039; to (face) them: &#039;&#039;&#039;He will speak to them&#039;&#039;&#039;, for that mankind did not believe with assurance in Our Signs. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Mountains and Birds can Sing Songs===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|34|10}}|&lt;br /&gt;
And assuredly We gave David grace from Us, (saying): O ye hills and birds, echo his psalms of praise! And We made the iron supple unto him}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==Others==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Mathematical Error in Hereditary Laws===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|4|11-12}}|&lt;br /&gt;
4.11: Allah (thus) directs you as regards your Children&#039;s (Inheritance): to the male, a portion equal to that of two females: if only daughters, two or more, their share is two-thirds of the inheritance; if only one, her share is a half. For parents, a sixth share of the inheritance to each, if the deceased left children; if no children, and the parents are the (only) heirs, the mother has a third; if the deceased Left brothers (or sisters) the mother has a sixth. (The distribution in all cases (&#039;s) after the payment of legacies and debts. Ye know not whether your parents or your children are nearest to you in benefit. These are settled portions ordained by Allah; and Allah is All-knowing, Al-wise. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
4.12: In what your wives leave, your share is a half, if they leave no child; but if they leave a child, ye get a fourth; after payment of legacies and debts. In what ye leave, their share is a fourth, if ye leave no child; but if ye leave a child, they get an eighth; after payment of legacies and debts. If the man or woman whose inheritance is in question, has left neither ascendants nor descendants, but has left a brother or a sister, each one of the two gets a sixth; but if more than two, they share in a third; after payment of legacies and debts; so that no loss is caused (to any one). Thus is it ordained by Allah; and Allah is All-knowing, Most Forbearing. }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
* Wife: 1/8 = 3/24,&lt;br /&gt;
* Daughters: 2/3 = 16/24,&lt;br /&gt;
* Father: 1/6 = 4/24,&lt;br /&gt;
* Mother: 1/6 = 4/24,&lt;br /&gt;
* &#039;&#039;&#039;Total&#039;&#039;&#039; = 27/24=1.125&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The total does not equal to 1. This error can never be reconciled in any way. [http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Contra/i001.html]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===People use the Forehead to Lie===&lt;br /&gt;
{{Main|Quran and the Lying Prefrontal Cerebrum|l1=Qur&#039;an and the Lying Prefrontal Cerebrum}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Brain wave technology has shown that electrical activity happens in the entire brain when a person is being deceitful. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|96|15-16}}|&lt;br /&gt;
Let him beware! If he desist not, We will drag him by the forelock. A lying, sinful forehead.}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Sailing of Ships is a Miracle ===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Ships float due to buoyancy and they can be driven by various sources of power.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|31|31}}| Seest thou not that the ships sail through the ocean by the Grace of Allah?- that He may show you of His signs? Verily in this are signs for all who constantly persevere and give thanks.  }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
===Space Flight is Impossible ===&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The first space ships and travel beyond the atmosphere of earth occurred over 60 years ago. With current technology, humankind has already explored the end of the solar system. The Qur&#039;an however, implies that going beyond the earth is forbidden.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Quote|{{Quran|55|33}}|&lt;br /&gt;
O ye assembly of Jinns and men! If it be ye can pass beyond the zones of the heavens and the earth, pass ye! not without authority shall ye be able to pass! }}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
==See Also==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
{{Hub4|Contradictions and Errors|Contradictions and Errors}}&lt;br /&gt;
* [[Scientific Errors in the Qur&#039;an (Response)]] &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Qur&#039;an]]&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Islam and Science]]&lt;br /&gt;
[[Category:Inconsistencies]]&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Nightmare140</name></author>
	</entry>
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