Talk:Not All Muslims Are Terrorists: Difference between revisions

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The article says, "The martyr can plea to Allah (once he arrives in Paradise) on behalf of up to seventy of his relatives to get them a ticket to Paradise."  The same sentence occurs on multiple websites, but I cannot find a source supporting it.  Most of the sites have a dead link at the end of the paragraph.<ref>https://feeds.feedburner.com/CitizenWarrior</ref><ref>http://www.dailyunconstitutional.com/answers-to-objections-when-you-talk-about-islam-part-6-3033/</ref><ref>http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2009/03/not-all-muslims-are-terrorists.html</ref><ref>http://nocompulsion.com/answers-to-objections-when-you-talk-about-islam/</ref><ref>http://solsticewitch13.blogspot.com/2016/01/not-all-muslims-are-terrorists.html</ref>  WikiIslam has a working link, but it does not appear to say what the sentence says.  I have tried to add a "citation needed" tag, but that page doesn't exist on WikiIslam.  Please advise?
The article says, "The martyr can plea to Allah (once he arrives in Paradise) on behalf of up to seventy of his relatives to get them a ticket to Paradise."  The same sentence occurs on multiple websites, but I cannot find a source supporting it.  Most of the sites have a dead link at the end of the paragraph.<ref>https://feeds.feedburner.com/CitizenWarrior</ref><ref>http://www.dailyunconstitutional.com/answers-to-objections-when-you-talk-about-islam-part-6-3033/</ref><ref>http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2009/03/not-all-muslims-are-terrorists.html</ref><ref>http://nocompulsion.com/answers-to-objections-when-you-talk-about-islam/</ref><ref>http://solsticewitch13.blogspot.com/2016/01/not-all-muslims-are-terrorists.html</ref>  WikiIslam has a working link, but it does not appear to say what the sentence says.  I have tried to add a "citation needed" tag, but that page doesn't exist on WikiIslam.  Please advise?[[User:Curious|Curious]] ([[User talk:Curious|talk]]) 22:32, 27 January 2016 (EST)
:I havent looked into this in much detail but is this the ref you're looking for? If so, please add the ref to the page too (the full text, just like its used in the page I linked). [https://wikiislam.net/wiki/72_Virgins#cite_note-alMiqdaam-32] --[[User:Axius|Axius]] <span style="font-size:88%">([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] <nowiki>|</nowiki> [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])</span> 06:53, 28 January 2016 (EST)
:I havent looked into this in much detail but is this the ref you're looking for? If so, please add the ref to the page too (the full text, just like its used in the page I linked). [https://wikiislam.net/wiki/72_Virgins#cite_note-alMiqdaam-32] --[[User:Axius|Axius]] <span style="font-size:88%">([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] <nowiki>|</nowiki> [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])</span> 06:53, 28 January 2016 (EST)
Thanks - I followed your link, and found the hadith quotation.  Copying that into search engines yielded many sources (including <ref>https://books.google.com/books?id=6hQb4as83J0C&lpg=PA203&ots=bxIO430Jtb&dq=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22will%20be%20permitted%20to%20intercede%20for%20seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&pg=PA203#v=onepage&q=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22will%20be%20permitted%20to%20intercede%20for%20seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&f=false</ref> <ref>https://books.google.com/books?id=VGXMBQAAQBAJ&lpg=PA63&ots=wH9idQ-gFr&dq=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22will%20be%20permitted%20to%20intercede%20for%20seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&pg=PA63#v=onepage&q=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22will%20be%20permitted%20to%20intercede%20for%20seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&f=false</ref> and <ref>http://www.hadithanswers.com/the-six-bounties-of-a-martyr-shahid/</ref> <ref>https://books.google.com/books?id=dpODBwAAQBAJ&pg=PT326&lpg=PT326&dq=%22The+martyr%22+%22seventy+of+his+relatives.%22&source=bl&ots=WRbu5S4VhT&sig=14y4FR8kK1iElkt8FW5EGWnPvjI&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwin_p220s3KAhVBzGMKHRU-Ar0Q6AEILTAE#v=onepage&q=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&f=false</ref>)  I suggest someone with editing privileges should add these or other source links to the article sentence about relatives.  Most of the discussions about that particular hadith seem to focus on the 70 whores (sp?), which might motivate lone gunmen, but plenty of other religions can produce lone gunmen.  A doctrine that can motivate a conspiracy of up to 70 related accessories (before and after the fact) to support attacks is much more difficult to deal with using western legal standards.[[User:Curious|Curious]] ([[User talk:Curious|talk]]) 22:32, 28 January 2016 (EST)
:This is nice but it doesnt quote the relevant full texts, which we should do when the issue is controversial (likely to be contested). Is it the same text as I linked?
:As for your additional other than the ref itself, we cant do that since its an essay by "Citizen Warrior" so we cant make major changes to it that could be attributed to the original author. Best to just give a ref to the existed statements. --[[User:Axius|Axius]] <span style="font-size:88%">([[User_talk:Axius|talk]] <nowiki>|</nowiki> [[Special:Contributions/Axius|contribs]])</span> 21:01, 29 January 2016 (EST)

Latest revision as of 02:01, 30 January 2016

The article says, "The martyr can plea to Allah (once he arrives in Paradise) on behalf of up to seventy of his relatives to get them a ticket to Paradise." The same sentence occurs on multiple websites, but I cannot find a source supporting it. Most of the sites have a dead link at the end of the paragraph.[1][2][3][4][5] WikiIslam has a working link, but it does not appear to say what the sentence says. I have tried to add a "citation needed" tag, but that page doesn't exist on WikiIslam. Please advise?Curious (talk) 22:32, 27 January 2016 (EST)

I havent looked into this in much detail but is this the ref you're looking for? If so, please add the ref to the page too (the full text, just like its used in the page I linked). [1] --Axius (talk | contribs) 06:53, 28 January 2016 (EST)

Thanks - I followed your link, and found the hadith quotation. Copying that into search engines yielded many sources (including [6] [7] and [8] [9]) I suggest someone with editing privileges should add these or other source links to the article sentence about relatives. Most of the discussions about that particular hadith seem to focus on the 70 whores (sp?), which might motivate lone gunmen, but plenty of other religions can produce lone gunmen. A doctrine that can motivate a conspiracy of up to 70 related accessories (before and after the fact) to support attacks is much more difficult to deal with using western legal standards.Curious (talk) 22:32, 28 January 2016 (EST)

This is nice but it doesnt quote the relevant full texts, which we should do when the issue is controversial (likely to be contested). Is it the same text as I linked?
As for your additional other than the ref itself, we cant do that since its an essay by "Citizen Warrior" so we cant make major changes to it that could be attributed to the original author. Best to just give a ref to the existed statements. --Axius (talk | contribs) 21:01, 29 January 2016 (EST)
  1. ↑ https://feeds.feedburner.com/CitizenWarrior
  2. ↑ http://www.dailyunconstitutional.com/answers-to-objections-when-you-talk-about-islam-part-6-3033/
  3. ↑ http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2009/03/not-all-muslims-are-terrorists.html
  4. ↑ http://nocompulsion.com/answers-to-objections-when-you-talk-about-islam/
  5. ↑ http://solsticewitch13.blogspot.com/2016/01/not-all-muslims-are-terrorists.html
  6. ↑ https://books.google.com/books?id=6hQb4as83J0C&lpg=PA203&ots=bxIO430Jtb&dq=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22will%20be%20permitted%20to%20intercede%20for%20seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&pg=PA203#v=onepage&q=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22will%20be%20permitted%20to%20intercede%20for%20seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&f=false
  7. ↑ https://books.google.com/books?id=VGXMBQAAQBAJ&lpg=PA63&ots=wH9idQ-gFr&dq=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22will%20be%20permitted%20to%20intercede%20for%20seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&pg=PA63#v=onepage&q=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22will%20be%20permitted%20to%20intercede%20for%20seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&f=false
  8. ↑ http://www.hadithanswers.com/the-six-bounties-of-a-martyr-shahid/
  9. ↑ https://books.google.com/books?id=dpODBwAAQBAJ&pg=PT326&lpg=PT326&dq=%22The+martyr%22+%22seventy+of+his+relatives.%22&source=bl&ots=WRbu5S4VhT&sig=14y4FR8kK1iElkt8FW5EGWnPvjI&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwin_p220s3KAhVBzGMKHRU-Ar0Q6AEILTAE#v=onepage&q=%22The%20martyr%22%20%22seventy%20of%20his%20relatives.%22&f=false
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